Decrease?
- Thread starter rachrp
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Sue and Oliver (GA)
Very Active Member
I posted on your other thread:
Wow! Just checked out your spreadsheet. You two had an interesting day! So glad you were home to test and give him some food to bring him up. Interesting that 1.4 takes him into the 40s but 1.2 doesn't do much. Maybe a fat 1.2 would do the trick? (a fat dose is when you draw up just a smidgen- scientific term - more than 1.2 and the try to let just a drop out do you have just a bit more than 1.2, but not up to 1.4).
To drop from 422 to 144 in 2 hours is very strange. Wonder if the 422 was sure a good test? The only other explanation I see is that he is really, really sensitive to food. Any way to lessen the carb count? Like if you're feeding 8%, could you drop to 4%? ( not all seafood though)
Wow! Just checked out your spreadsheet. You two had an interesting day! So glad you were home to test and give him some food to bring him up. Interesting that 1.4 takes him into the 40s but 1.2 doesn't do much. Maybe a fat 1.2 would do the trick? (a fat dose is when you draw up just a smidgen- scientific term - more than 1.2 and the try to let just a drop out do you have just a bit more than 1.2, but not up to 1.4).
To drop from 422 to 144 in 2 hours is very strange. Wonder if the 422 was sure a good test? The only other explanation I see is that he is really, really sensitive to food. Any way to lessen the carb count? Like if you're feeding 8%, could you drop to 4%? ( not all seafood though)
rachrp
Member
Haha, I just saw your last post after I posted this.
Yes, today was a very strange day. He seems extremely sensitive to food. The only explanation I had for the 442 was his grazing. I never let him graze like that, but he's just been taking so long to eat lately, so I just left it out. I actually just posted again about today's numbers in a new thread, and I hadn't seen your post yet. I was debating how much lower to go. His PMPS was 197, which I feel comfortable shooting at, knowing how he skyrockets after eating. Plus I'll be able to keep an eye on him tonight.
As far as the carb count, I believe it's already at 3 or 4%.
Yes, today was a very strange day. He seems extremely sensitive to food. The only explanation I had for the 442 was his grazing. I never let him graze like that, but he's just been taking so long to eat lately, so I just left it out. I actually just posted again about today's numbers in a new thread, and I hadn't seen your post yet. I was debating how much lower to go. His PMPS was 197, which I feel comfortable shooting at, knowing how he skyrockets after eating. Plus I'll be able to keep an eye on him tonight.
As far as the carb count, I believe it's already at 3 or 4%.
Grayson & Lu
Very Active Member
I know what you're going though - it's just like the first few times I saw blue, and even green. Your first instinct is to reduce. Mine was too. I've delayed, I've dropped, and it took many days, even weeks, to make up for lost ground.
On ProZinc, last January 13 to May 31, my "do not shoot" number was 250. Most of the time, that wasn't an issue, as his numbers rarely moved out of the pinks. But even my vet, when we were reviewing his spreadsheet, commented that many of the times I didn't shoot, that it would've been safe to do so.
I've always tried to err on the side of caution, and usually recommend others do the same too.
In reviewing your SS, it wasn't until you got to 1.4 that you saw blue. Not scary blue, but nice blues. But it looks like you shot reds by +13 (be sure not to "reset" your numbers until you shoot). Based on what my vet told me, and now with a little over a year under my belt, I am more willing to shoot lower numbers. But Grayson has another condition, so I've had to learn to do this.
I would be inclined to hold the dose. Look how quickly he climbed between +12 and +13. Seems like the insulin is completely out of the body in 13 hrs. You've got a good amt of data, and IMHO enough to maybe adjust down your "do not shoot" number. Or perhaps Robin can suggest a sliding scale... something like 1.4 over 250, and 1.2 200-249, and 1.0 @ 150-199. That way, your kitty wouldn't spike so much at the end.
I've learned I can't skip a shot. I can either reduce or delay if he's really low. Some people can do both. I can't. But these are decisions that you have to test and see what works best for YOUR kitty.
Lu-Ann
On ProZinc, last January 13 to May 31, my "do not shoot" number was 250. Most of the time, that wasn't an issue, as his numbers rarely moved out of the pinks. But even my vet, when we were reviewing his spreadsheet, commented that many of the times I didn't shoot, that it would've been safe to do so.
I've always tried to err on the side of caution, and usually recommend others do the same too.
In reviewing your SS, it wasn't until you got to 1.4 that you saw blue. Not scary blue, but nice blues. But it looks like you shot reds by +13 (be sure not to "reset" your numbers until you shoot). Based on what my vet told me, and now with a little over a year under my belt, I am more willing to shoot lower numbers. But Grayson has another condition, so I've had to learn to do this.
I would be inclined to hold the dose. Look how quickly he climbed between +12 and +13. Seems like the insulin is completely out of the body in 13 hrs. You've got a good amt of data, and IMHO enough to maybe adjust down your "do not shoot" number. Or perhaps Robin can suggest a sliding scale... something like 1.4 over 250, and 1.2 200-249, and 1.0 @ 150-199. That way, your kitty wouldn't spike so much at the end.
I've learned I can't skip a shot. I can either reduce or delay if he's really low. Some people can do both. I can't. But these are decisions that you have to test and see what works best for YOUR kitty.
Lu-Ann
Sue and Oliver (GA)
Very Active Member
Nice cycle last night. And I like your dose this am. Any midcycle numbers you can get today will help fill in the picture. You both are doing great job!
rachrp
Member
Thanks for your input Lu-Ann. I'm extremely hesitant lately to shoot those low 200s and high 100s. I'm also one who can't skip a shot, or he will skyrocket. And he's majorly affected by food.
I know every cat is different, but what's the general rule of thumb for decreasing? If they go below 50? The greens have been giving me fits the last few days because we've never been in this territory before. What's the lowest I should allow him to go without reducing?
I know every cat is different, but what's the general rule of thumb for decreasing? If they go below 50? The greens have been giving me fits the last few days because we've never been in this territory before. What's the lowest I should allow him to go without reducing?
Sue and Oliver (GA)
Very Active Member
In general with ProZinc, you reduce if they are 40 or under at nadir, or if the preshot is under 200. When you get more data and feel more comfortable, you can shoot on lower preshots - some people shoot 150 or above. But not until you have data and feel safe doing that and can monitor.
IMHO, you are just starting to see nice numbers. I'd take it slow.
IMHO, you are just starting to see nice numbers. I'd take it slow.
Rob & Harley (GA)
Very Active Member
I think there are a couple of things going on here. You've found the ceiling for your good dose is 1.4u.
As much as I wish there was a set in stone protocol for Prozinc there just isn't. Instead we need to take into consideration PS's, nadirs, weather they are bouncing from a low number, etc.
I think todays pink PS's are a small bounce from the green numbers he hasn't seen for a week or so. I like the current trends. Don't be afraid of the greens, they are normal non diabetic numbers and where we want them to be all the time and is what we are working towards everyday.
You are doing a great job of testing btw.
You will probably need to reduce the dose soon, maybe if you posted everyday we can keep a closer eye on him and can see a reduction coming.
You guys are doing a wonderful job.
As much as I wish there was a set in stone protocol for Prozinc there just isn't. Instead we need to take into consideration PS's, nadirs, weather they are bouncing from a low number, etc.
I think todays pink PS's are a small bounce from the green numbers he hasn't seen for a week or so. I like the current trends. Don't be afraid of the greens, they are normal non diabetic numbers and where we want them to be all the time and is what we are working towards everyday.
You are doing a great job of testing btw.
You will probably need to reduce the dose soon, maybe if you posted everyday we can keep a closer eye on him and can see a reduction coming.
You guys are doing a wonderful job.
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