Charley 2/12

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Charleysmom

Charleysmom

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Hi everyone. I've been posting in the main health forum and after a hypo today, it was suggested that I come to this forum. Charley is my 9 year old kitty just diagnosed 1/9. I took my paper copy of his numbers and transferred them to his spreadsheet this afternoon. I'm to a frustration point with the vet, he keeps raising insulin based on the pre-shot numbers. Today was the first time I tried to take a curve - good thing I did. This is after the vet said home testing was not necessary. Please take a look....
 
Hi charley's mom...
I am so glad you came over here...
great group and we can all help you with dosing....
what is your name
I am Denise and my cat is Shakespeare,
We had a near hypo today , so I understand how you are feeling right now,
but it will get easier, and the spreadsheet will help and the testing, as you have found today
so very important...
 
Hi Denise. My name is Michelle. Thank you for your kindness. I am simply overwhelmed by all of this. We have had a rough year with our kitties. My 18 year old kitty Gator was hyperthyroid, and despite treating him he died in March of 2011. After he passed, our 15 year old Friday became sick with kidney issues and passed in July of 2011. In October we adopted Sterling and Gizmo. Sterling is now 15 months old, Gizmo is 9 months old. Charley's diagnosis in January really caught us off guard. He was losing weight and drinking a lot. At dx his bg was 565. Fructosamine was 680 - no ketones. I'm trying to educate myself as much as possible, but when I show my graphs and charts to the vet and try to have a discussion - I'm getting not an attitude from him - but a clear message that he is the vet and he knows best. He originally wanted Charley to start at 3 units. I'm quite sure that would have killed him. I'm going to test him again shortly. I am very worried about the damage all of these spikes can be doing. The advice from the health board was to go back to 1 unit. My husband and I are both teachers, so we are gone from 6am to 4:30pm. I will try to start testing at night too - before bed. Plan to do a curve on the 1 unit next Saturday. In the meantime, the vet wants him for weekly bg testing - he thinks home testing is useless unless we use a AlphaTrak. Our meter has had a 60-80 point comparison difference. I told my husband there is no guarantee their meter is the correct number either. He has been basing all dosage on the pre shot numbers. Will let you know what he says after his visit Wednesday. I'm sure he won't be happy that we are taking Charley's dosage into our own hands.
 
I am so sorry you have had such a hard year...
There have been so many vets that say that home testing is a waste...
but as you stay on here and do more reading you will see that it has saved so many kitties
lives, that you would not want to listen to your vet and stop testing,
Just because he is the vet does not make him more experienced
sometime the best thing to do, whether for your cat or yourself
is take your own health andhealing into your own hands.
You vet is not there with you and your cat every day, it is YOUR cat and you are the one
who is the care taker and who knows your cat the best.

What dose are you thinking of shooting tonight?
 
Welcome Denise and Charley! Great job with the low numbers this morning.

I agree with everyone else that he is getting too much insulin. Your instincts are right. If you just look at preshot numbers, they can be high because he is dropping low mid cyle and bouncing back up.

He may be high tonight because he is bouncing from the low today, or you may get a long cycle. Both are indications of too much insulin. Regardless , you want to give less insulin.

I would continue to test (great job BTW) and see where you are at +12. Then come on for advice. This is a much smaller forum than Health but there are usually people on in the am and pm and weekends.

Life does get in the way of testing. Some people get an out the door and in the door test to fill in the picture and a nadir for some pm cycles. The more data, the easier it is to figure things out, but it has to work with your life.
 
Advice needed - His bg is 541. I'm assuming the spike is from the high carb food I gave him when he hit 33. Should I just give the 1 unit tonight?
 
Are you at +12?

I am cautious. With the hypo, it may take several cycles to get "real" numbers again. His body has released some extra glucose (his liver felt those low numbers and panicked) so his number has bounced up. I think I would give .5 if you are at +12. You are heading into the night time cycle when you can't watch him. See if you can get a couple tests this evening before bed.
 
Sue and Oliver (GA) said:
Are you at +12?

I am cautious. With the hypo, it may take several cycles to get "real" numbers again. His body has released some extra glucose (his liver felt those low numbers and panicked) so his number has bounced up. I think I would give .5 if you are at +12. You are heading into the night time cycle when you can't watch him. See if you can get a couple tests this evening before bed.
Click to expand...

Yes, we're at +12. He's eating his dinner. We usually test 5:15-5:20am and pm.
 
Hi Michelle,
I am with SUe on this one...I think it might be best to give .50 unit tonight.
and take a test or 2...I just have a fuinny feeling that 1 unit might have been a little high

I am ususally on early morning between 5 and 5:30 am so I will log on by 5am
to see how you are doing
 
Hi Michelle,
I use an AlphaTrak but I can't say its perfect. I started with a Relion Micro and I think its probably just fine. I switched to the Alpha on my vet's recommendation but she is very much in support of me home testing. My Ruby gets really stressed when I take her to the vet and her numbers go thru the roof. We decided its best to try to keep her out of the office as much as I can, for everyone's sake.
The Alpha does test higher than the human meters but they have been very much in synch for me, rising and falling along the same curves.
On the high end (300s), the Alpha will test up to 80 or so points higher than the Relion and on the lower end (100s) its closer to 30 points difference.

I don't have any advice really, just letting you know my experience with the Alpha. The strips are crazy expensive and I've been blowing thru them like water, but its my choice.
 
Welcome to PZIville, Michelle and Charley! cat_pet_icon

FDMB has a ton of super friendly knowledgeable folks, and if I do say so myself, the cream of the crop are found here in PZIville! ;-) (You'll have to pardon me...I am a bit of a jokester. :lol: )

Seriously, though, we do have some of the greatest folks here in PZI land. :-D

Don't hesitate to ask questions. We are all here to help our and other's fur babies. :mrgreen:
 
Hello Michelle and sweet Charley :)

I don't have dosing advice but I just wanted to stop in and reiterate what was said above... When it comes down to it, he's your cat. My vet also started me at 3 units and I came here and immediately backed it down to 1 and then back up to 2 and tested at nadir to make sure my Scout wasn't going low. A month later, we're on day 5 of no insulin and if I'd been shooting blindly she would have hypoed and bounced multiple times by now. Fortunately, my vet has taken my feedback and has been very supportive of testing and dropping the dosage.

It is wonderful that you did a curve and caught the hypo. You are doing great. Give Charley a scritch for me!!

Lori
 
Hi Michelle, I'm glad you came over here. You are catching up very quickly, good job with the spreadsheet and a pic of the very handsom Charley.

I'm sorry to hear you've had so many loses recently, I know how hard that can be, I just lost my Harley last month to kidney failure, I just havn't had the heart to put the GA behind our names yet.

Unfortunately not all vets are willing to work with us as partners. But the truth is that the Vets are in our employ, we are paying them for their opinions and guidance, not to be told what we must or must not do, Charley is your family member and you are the best advocate for him, so you get to choose what advise you feel comfortable going with, geez you can come here and we'll give you our 2 cents for free. :lol:

Stick around and ask whatever questions you have.
 
362 at +2 for his .5 unit dose. Is he more inclined to hypo again because of this afternoon? I will test him again in 2 hours.
 
Let me be sure I have this right...from looking at your SS, you shot a reduced dose of .5 tonight...correct?
 
From looking at your SS this is what I gather...you shot 2 units this morning and reduced to .5 tonight.

Normally after a hypo, one of two things happens. Either the cat will be extremely sensitive to insulin, making them more likely to hypo again or they will have a few (1 to 3 normally) cycles to clear the bounce from the liver panicking and dumping sugar and the feeding of high carb foods.

With your reduction to .5, you should have the sensitivity issue covered! The 500+ preshot tonight, is a bounce and it will clear on its own, it just is a matter of when. You are right to be vigilant and test tonight, but with the reduction I would expect you to be okay tonight.

One of the biggest mistakes that people make is shooting the bounce. Like tonight, when you saw the 500+ preshot, many people shoot that as a true BG and either hold or increase the dose. By testing midcycle, you know that it is a bounce and you did not shoot into it! Good Job!
 
294 at +4 from his pm dose of .5 units. Poor baby's ears. I tested him 10 times today. That's a lot of pokes. So grateful he is so good about it. That may be it for the night. I'm hoping with only .5 he is going to be ok.
 
That sounds good. Do you have Neosporin with pain relief? You can put a small smear on his ears to help bruising.

Difficult but successful day for you tow!
 
That sounds good. Do you have Neosporin with pain relief? You can put a small smear on his ears to help bruising.

Difficult but successful day for you two!
 
He probably is okay, but you are at a very similar place as you were this morning at +4. You had a big drop between +3 and +6 this morning, but obviously on a much higher dose. It looks like he definitely needed less insulin.
 
ok, thats good and the preshot came down also...
If you can you might want to get a number tonight before you go to bed..
 
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