Changed to Lantus on Friday

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Tim & Chris

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Tim switched to Lantus on Friday. Is there a general time peroid when they start to show progress? His numbers are still not moving. I will do my best to get a spreadsheet started today but I have family obligations so time is limited. When he was at the vet on Wed he was 499. That was with no short for about 18 hours. I gave him insulin at 8 this moring his reading was 389. At 11:15 he was at 285.I'll try to get away early to get his spreadsheet going. Will I need to include his last week on PZI for comparsion?
His blood test were borderline. He is concentrating his urine but it isn't as good as it could be. His gravity was at 1025.
His BUN was 47 Creatine 1.75 White Blood Cell Count 4800 His T4 was normal and lypocytes OK. There was glucose in his urine but no ketones.The vet is concerned about his kidney function. She doesn't want to treat yet. But wants reports an is glucose level every few days. He HAS to get lower SOON. Oh, she started him on 1U BID. So he's really only had 3 shots of Lantus now. I'm pretty sure 1 was a fur shot because I got the syringes from Wal Mart to save money and frankly, they stink. Thery aren't very sharp and the needle is too short. If I can't get him lower I am seriously looking at tight regulation.
Can you do that with Lantus?

Thanks for your help
Chris
 
Hi Tim


Welcome to Lantus Land Tim and Chris!

yes, please add your PZI numbers to your spreadsheet.

Here in this forum we use this modified version of the Tilly Protocol, that has worked well for many kitties.
Tilly's Protocol: Modified Version

You can find lots more info up above in the "starred" stickies.

Others will be along thru the day to offer feedback.
Again welcome to the group!
 
welcome to the group Chris.

first thing - you need to get a spreadsheet posted so that we can better assist you, without it, it's hard for us to determine what is going on.

Also, we don't talk in actual time, rather we talk in hours here - meaning if you tested and gave a shot at 8 am - that is your AMPS (morning - AM, preshot- PS) number. if you then tested him at 11 am - that would be at +3 - 3 hours after shot time.

So, to write it would look like this:

AMPS 389
+3 285


Also, please be sure to read the starred information at the top of this forum - it gives you all the information you need to learn about how lantus works. Especially the need to shoot every 12 hours.

So, put your spreadsheet together, post it, come back and we can better help you.


I used the Walmart Relion syringes with the short needle and they worked fine. It could be your technique that is off and why you got a fur shot. Where are you shooting? And are you tenting the skin?

this may help:

Injection sites for cats

Tenting pics

why was there 18 hours between shots? If you are following the Tilly protocol, you need to shoot in 12 hour increments. While there is some leeway to that, there is not 6 hours of leeway.
 
I use the same technique I've been using for the last 4 years. I never had a problem until I got these syringes.
Sorry I posted times. I thought That you guys didn't use the +3 way anymore. That's the way I always did it before but got told that wasd wrong. So I'll go back to doing it that way. BTW, I'm not at all new to diabetes. Tim has had it for at least 4 years. I successfully treated him into remission for almost 2 years. So you don't have to go through all the new stuff.
I'm just new to Lantus.

Thanks for your help. As I said before, as soon as I can I will get a spreadsheet together.
 
We had no way of knowing that you aren't new to FD. Sorry if what we wrote offended you.

As you can see there a lot of cats on this board and new ones every day, unless you tell us you aren't new to this, we have no way of knowing.

When you can provide the spreadsheet, please do and yes include the PZI time and in the comment section, please label it PZI so we know the difference.
 
welcome to Lantus Land, Chris!

It takes a few days for Lantus to build its "shed," so most of us don't see any response right away. Also, you might not see much response until you get to the right dose. It's funny how Lantus seems to work, you see a whole lotta nothing, keep increasing the dose and still nothing, until one day BAM! Lots of action. It goes from nothing to everything. Happens all the time, I don't know why but try not to get too frustrated.

What was Tim's good dose on PZI?
 
Tim was on 2U BID of PZI. It was compounded locally and was the least effective of any insulin he's been on. He did great on PZI Vet. Then changed to the BCP PZI and did well. This stuff has been horrible. But it's all I could get from my vet.
She decided to switch to Lantus because many of her clints are doing better on Lantus. Thanks for your input about how long it takes to see change. I am very worried about Tim because he is 16 and starting to show signs of kidney disease.
I'm very late so I'll have to post my spreadsheet later.

Thanks so much for your help. It helps to know it takes a little while to kick in.
Chris
 
it does take time to kick in, and also Lantus is usually found to be less potent than PZI (most cats require a higher dose of Lantus than of PZI). So probably Tim is not at the right dose yet. It doesn't necessarily have to take a long time to get there, once you get your spreadsheet up we can take a look. Depending on the numbers, you can increase the dose faster than our standard 3-5 days. If you'll look at my foster kitty Jazzy's spreadsheet, she just switched from PZI to Lantus a couple of weeks ago. I started her at a lower dose than her PZI dose (she was on 7 units of PZI, I started Lantus at 3 units), just to be sure, but have fast tracked the increases because it was pretty obvious that I started at too low a dose. Jazzy is a higher dose cat, don't worry about how big the dose is, just the pattern. ;-)
 
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