Cat throwing up three days ina row

[jamies]

hi everyone

I have a couple questions.
Three days ina row Willy has thrown up
Tuesday was spit in the morning
Wed maybe Thur morning I'm not sure I found it on the floor
Last night was a lot around after dinner ( he didn't get his second shot)
Is this abnormal? ) he had been off pred for a week and I'm wondering if that is contributing to it


I have only tested him twice home b cause part of me is terrified to do it

He still seems very tired and still peeing a lot and drinking. He's only been on a week so I'm assuming it's because it needs to be regulated? Is this normal or does it take a while

How do I know when him being too tired is not normal?

A couple times he seems to be breathing to fast and he also has a heart condition so that's adding into my fear.

Any advice would be helpful.

Also it is going to be impossible for me to test during the day be cause I work full time. Does anyone have any suggestions for this? His peak time after shots is when I'm at work so that's also adding into my fear of being so new

Thanks

 

[jamies]

I also want to add I feel like I'm doing everything wrong. Is he eating too much is eating too little.
I tried to cut the dry food out and was that soon?
I'm sorry the more I read up on it the more I get confused

 

[Kris & Teasel]

I have only tested him twice home b cause part of me is terrified to do it

Hi Jamie,
Yes, home testing is scary at first but it's the best way to know how Willow is doing. The more testing you do, the better you get at it and the scariness subsides. No way around it ...

Is this normal or does it take a while

Regulating a kitty takes a while, sometimes a long while. You've only started treating Willow.

being too tired is not normal?

Lethargy/fatigue/malaise along with too much peeing and drinking are all part of kitty having blood glucose that is too high but it improves over time as BG becomes better controlled with insulin.

A couple times he seems to be breathing to fast

I'm not sure what to say about this. It could be related to weakness, etc. from BG levels but you need to test to know what's happening.

Also it is going to be impossible for me to test during the day be cause I work full time

There are multitudes of FDMB members who work full time. They do more testing on weekends or other days off, during the evening, or even set an alarm to test in the night especially if they're concerned about the effect of a dose.

Is he eating too much is eating too little.

Many diabetic cats eat a fair bit because the disease prevents nutrients from being properly used by their body. Some eat less because they don't feel well. What's very important with Vetsulin is that your kitty eats a meal before you give a dose of insulin. Vetsulin can act quickly and he needs food on board so his BG doesn't drop too low too fast.

I tried to cut the dry food out and was that soon?

Stopping all dry food is recommended. It can have a significant effect on BG so testing is critical. It's not a good idea to increase insulin dose until all dry food is out of his diet and you have BG test numbers for a couple of 12 hour cycles (the time from one dose to the next is a cycle).

I hope I've given you some useful info, Jamie. You can tell how imortant testing Willow's blood glucose is to the whole process. I strongly encourage you to spend time practicing. Turn it into something pleasant for him that's done in a certain place, with lots of pets, scratches, etc. Freeze dried meat treats are a really good reward to use. I guarantee that over time this will become routine to you. We understand how daunting this whole thing is.

There was a lot of back and forth a few days ago as we discussed the dose your vet had recommended and whether to dose once or twice a day. What dose are you giving Willow right now? Have you been dosing twice a day?

 

[Kris & Teasel]

Another useful test to learn to do is a urine ketone test. You can buy ketone test strips (g. Bayer "KetoDiastix") at any human pharmacy. Some kitties don't mind having the strip held in their urine stream when they're using the litter box. I hold a long handled spoon under Teasel's backside while he pees. Some people put a layer of kitchen plastic wrap over the litter in kitty's preferred pee spot and urine collects in the wrinkles. There's a colour guide on the test strip bottle to see where kitty's urine fall. Anything more than "trace" for urine ketones requires a vet visit.

I mention this because a diabetic cat can vomit from feeling unwell due to high BG but another reason can be from ketones building up. There are other non-diabetes causes, of course.

 

[CassAndGordy(GA)]

When I first switched to wet food, Gordy would wake me up every night around 3am vomiting bile. I changed up when I fed him and made sure he got something to eat before I went to sleep, and it fixed it. I think he was a little too hungry.

(But every cat is different, this is just my experience.)

 

[Olive & Paula]

You can feed smaller meals but more often. Feed every 4 or 6 hours. My guy had to eat every 3 hours. An automatic feeder would help when your working or overnight. Try grain free food.

 

[jamies]

Yes two doses a day.

I will get the urine sticks today.

He seems very nauseous. He meows to eat but then doesn't eat a lot.

I'm afraid every time I leave I leave my house. I hope this gets better

 

[Kris & Teasel]

Has your kitty been checked for pancreatitis? It's very painful and can cause nausea and vomiting. The rapid breathing you mentioned earlier could be a sign of pain. If he was my cat and hadn't begun to improve by tomorrow I'd want the vet to have a look at him again. Not eating enough along with high blood glucose can be serious.

 

[Critter Mom]

Has your kitty been checked for pancreatitis? It's very painful and can cause nausea and vomiting. The rapid breathing you mentioned earlier could be a sign of pain.

I agree with the above PLUS I'd also worry about whether the rapid breathing might be related to low blood sugar. You state above that you're now giving two doses a day. WHAT SIZE DOSE??? Also please can you confirm which type of insulin you are using.

The lethargy you mention could potentially be due to Willy getting used to the insulin OR it could be due to illness/diabetes complications. Again it is something you need to let your vet know about ASAP.

I think the best thing is to get your vet to examine Willy as a matter of urgency (don't wait till Monday). A pancreatitis blood test would be a very good thing to ask for - if only to rule it out. If your vet can do a SNAP fPL test at the time of the examination you'd get a yes/no answer immediately (Spec fPL has to be sent to an external lab). Also it is critical that Willy is tested for ketones as a matter of urgency (especially because of the eating issues). If you take Willy to the vet on Saturday bring a urine sample with you (vet may not have a blood ketone meter).

Was the steroid treatment for IBD? The cessation of steroid treatment plus a diet change could also be a possible cause for the GI upset.

The presence of appetite is a big positive but if your vet could give you some supportive meds for nausea (Cerenia, ondansetron generic) and pain relief (buprenorphine) it could help Willy feel better. If the appetite looks like petering out cyproheptadine can help stimulate appetite (gentler and gives better dosing control than mirtazapine and it doesn't carry the risk of serotonin syndrome).

I'm afraid every time I leave I leave my house. I hope this gets better

I've been in the situation where I was trying to address nausea problems and treating with insulin at the same time; it is really tough going and very scary. My heart well and truly goes out to you, Jamie, because I can very much relate to your feelings right now. If you can get supportive meds for the nausea it could make things a lot better for both of you.

Re testing, it's not ideal to have to prick our little ones to get blood samples for BG testing. One may feel scared and guilty at the start but not knowing what is going on BG-wise is far worse. (I had to blind dose Saoirse in the early stages of her insulin treatment because our then vet completely refused any support for my wish to home test; it was a truly nightmarish experience.) Adopting a very 'business-like' approach to the testing can help assuage the fear/guilt. If you can get the AM and PM preshot tests plus a mid-cycle 'before bed' test in the evening on your work days it will give you some guide to dose safety. Additional daytime and night-time mid-cycle tests on days when you're at home will further add to your picture of how Willy is responding to his insulin.

I tried to cut the dry food out and was that soon?

It is hard to suggest much to you, Jamie, without seeing any BG data but can you let us know ASAP when you tried to change from a dry to a wet diet; was Willy already started on insulin before you started to change his food? This is really important because the BG levels can drop quickly and very significantly with the food change and Willy's dose may be too high (hence all the safety warnings here to never do a diet change for a cat on insulin UNLESS one is closely monitoring BG levels at home throughout the switching period because there is a high probability that the insulin dose will need to be reduced in line with the reduced carb load).

I also want to add I feel like I'm doing everything wrong.

Many of us here are very familiar with that feeling; love'll do that to you every time. There is a lot to learn but things do get better.




Mogs
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[Critter Mom]

You can feed smaller meals but more often. Feed every 4 or 6 hours. My guy had to eat every 3 hours. An automatic feeder would help when your working or overnight. Try grain free food.

Heartily second this recommendation - especially the suggestion about getting a timed feeder; they've preserved the sanity of many members here!


Mogs
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[jamies]

It is vesulin 2 units twice a. Day
He always eats wet food it was justones that were higher in carbs. The wet food was always important because his ibd, but I did leave dry food out during the day in a auntomatic feeder
It was probably less than even a 1/4 a day by it was left because his meals are split and ya too avoid him getting hungry and throwing up.

The steroids were for ibd but he was a very low dose because of his heart.

Before we have tried to ween the pred and he would throw up so he had to be put back on

He does take Pepcid. Ironically just before this he wasn't getting it all the time because of thought I finally had the ibd under control
And no this.

He cannot take cerenia.last year he was hospitalized for his liver and he he had a horrible reaction to it and just stopped eating.

I will ask about the other. He was given mirtazapine but I don't like the way he was acting and he was breathing to fast but it should be out of his system but now.


He was twice tested for pancreatitis but it was a while ago so maybe it's something I have to look into.

It's super hard with the meds and the heart and the ibd and now the diabetes. It is truly a struggle. Everything he takes kinda has a risk with the other

I'm calling the vet tomm morning. They were closed today due to the holiday

Thanks for all the advice

 

[SweetAngel]

Jamies, look how far you've come already and be proud of yourself. You've stood up for your cat and are dosing twice a day, you're home testing, and you're asking for advice. Even after all this time I still hate doing Angel's blood tests and it's rather hit and miss and his poor ears are like a dartboard. But it doesn't seem to hurt him, more of an inconvenience. I still remember the feeling of being scared every time I left the house, esp as the trial Angel was on had me dosing him at scarily low numbers. 2nd time around I am a bit more chilled but I still worry and that's natural, they are our babies.

I don't know enough about his other conditions and the meds, pretty sure steroids can cause diabetes or make it worse though. Is there any reason your vet gave you vetinsulin rather than prozinc?

When you talk to the vet don't be intimidated, they are there to help your baby and god knows they get paid enough.

Hope everything goes well x

 

[Kris & Teasel]

Yes, pat yourself on the back for your progress at a scary, confusing time.

 

[jamies]

He's in the ER and has to stay there overnight.
He's not eating properly and he's sugar is still high

 

[SweetAngel]

((((Jamies)))) thinking of you and your furbaby. He's in the best place xx

 

[Kris & Teasel]

I'm sorry your kitty is ill and in hospital, Jamie. However, not eating and high BG is a bad combination and can cause, among many things, diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA). This needs veterinary intensive care. I've been through it with my cat and it's scary. Crossed fingers your kitty recovers soon.

 

[Critter Mom]

He's in the ER and has to stay there overnight.
He's not eating properly and he's sugar is still high

((((((((Jamie))))))))

I hear you about how hard and upsetting it is trying to juggle treatments for multiple conditions and I'm very sorry to hear that Willy is at the ER but it's better that he's in the right place to get intensive help. Some members here have cats that need steroid treatment as well as insulin treatment. Perhaps you could ask the vets about this. (@Larry and Kitties advised on another thread here that budesonide helps the GI tract but has less impact on BG levels. I don't know whether that might be something which could help Willy but it might be worth asking about.)

When Saoirse was first diagnosed she was treated with Vetsulin and she had GI problems after she started treatment - and this was BEFORE she was switched to a wet diet. Saoirse was also diagnosed with pancreatitis at the same time but she had her first bad flare AFTER starting insulin treatment. Saoirse did better both generally and GI-wise when her insulin was switched to Lantus. It might be worth asking the vets if another insulin might agree better with Willy.

I'm sending both of you many, many heartfelt, healing prayers.




Mogs
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[Marlena]

Jamie, you have done the right thing for your kitty. They will check him, test him and give him what he needs to go through this crisis.
Sending prayers for both of you and keeping my fingers crossed for quick recovery.

 

[jamies]

Thanks
Good news everything came back ok(ultra, blood, urine)
He did eat there
Bad news we really don't know why he is throwing up. He does have his issues with ibd so that could play a roll plus the pred no longer in the picture.
They really want to stay away from some sort of steroid because of his heart. We have to see how he does
I could have picked him up today but I thought it would be better if they can go over his glucose and kinda see what needs to be changed.
She is going to consult with my vet about what options we should take. ( changing of insulin, units, two doses a day)
I'm picking him up tomm morning
This has been pretty scary. I just wish this would regulate faster although I know he was just diagnosed and it could take a while.
It just stinks poor guy

 

[Marlena]

Jamie,
there are many problems with digestive track which cause vomiting.
Ask the vet about gastroparesis ( slow stomach emptying) which is common in diabetics and causes vomiting. Just a thought.
Marlena

 

[Olive & Paula]

Gastroparesis is good to ask about. How often are you feeding Willy? Smokey needed to be fed every 3 hrs around the clock. Very rarely could he go 4 hrs without vomiting.

 

[Critter Mom]

Relieved to hear that Willy has eaten today.

Are the ER vets doing checks of his BG and also his ketone levels? It would help you if you can get the readings from them.

Re feeding, because Vetsulin exerts its strongest BG-lowering effect in the early part of the cycle you need to give a fair amount of the total food allowance for the cycle about 30 minutes before administering the dose so that the insulin has 'something to work on' when it kicks in. For info, when Saoirse was on that particular insulin she would vomit liquid if she fasted for longer than about 3.5 hours (usually foamy and clear but sometimes a little brown in colour). I discussed this with her vet and thereafter I fed her half the food allowance for the cycle before the insulin dose, just under a quarter of the allowance at +3 and +6 after the dose and the balance of the allowance as a small snack at +9 after the dose so that she'd have a little something in her tummy until the next meal was due (used a timed feeder). It stopped the vomiting.

Sending more prayers that Willy's appetite will continue to improve and that the nausea gets resolved ASAP. Try to get a good night's sleep for yourself while the ER vets are looking after him; my guess is that you must be completely exhausted with all the worry.




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[jamies]

Thank you. I will ask the internist tomm.

I do break up his meals now( ibd) but I will try that method and see if it helps. Maybe I'm giving the shot too soon ( I was waiting about 20 min)

His Bg was 195 this morning, then 210, when I called at 7 250 they didn't give him insulin yet( at night) he got a shot this morning

Thanks again for the advice.
Hoping at least for now we can just get a slight grip on this and at least keep it more steady when he comes home.

I am exhausted! It's been a long two weeks!

 

[Critter Mom]

Praying for you to have a deep, restorative and refreshing sleep tonight, Jamie; it will be good for you and good for Willy.




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