Brand New to board, veteran sugarcat mom

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bartcat

Member Since 2012
Hello!
I'm Cat (really - short for catherine) and my sugarcat is Bart. Bart is 13 yrs old and was diagnosed as diabetic when he was 5, during an emergency visit due to ketoacidosis. He only had a 30% chance of living, was hospitalized for almost 2 weeks, so he's my ongoing miracle. I have been (mis?)managing his diabetes on my own for 8 years. I was home testing only when he was symptomatic (high or low) so I could make minor adjustments to his dose based on his specific cues/behaviors. Amazingly, he only suffered a few moderate hypos over this period and was doing good though unpredictably variable. He was on a mix of can and dry DM and 6 units of prozinc every 12 hrs. As he's gotten older, he has become more variable harder to regulate. So, I recently made the decision to see what more i could do without big vet money, and found the board(just a couple weeks ago)! Which brings me to the here and now:
Bart is a big boy - 18 lbs, which is actually very fit for him. I dont think he has acro, he is very well proportioned, but will get him testing at our annual vet visit in about a month or so. I switched him to only can a couple weeks ago. Being a horrible mom who didnt have the time to do full research, I did not realize that it takes a lot more volume of can to get him his needed calories without supplemental dry, and left him pretty hungry and slimming down quickly until he hypo'd about 10 days ago. Pulled him outta that and then spent every spare moment learning from this forum. Starting over with his treatment:
Got an autofeeder and feeding him every 3 hrs now. Mostly fancy feast and some friskies - the low carb ones per the board and Binky's. Start low go slow - he's now on 2 units (a third of original dosing) prozinc every 12 hrs and has been for about a week - before i adjusted dosage too quickly i know now. He is still running in the 300's preshot and i think i should increase him to 2.5 but wanted to get the experts opinions (you!). I am away from home for about 12.5 hrs on Tuesday through Friday days, due to work. So, I dont know if i should up his dose during the week when nobody is home... However, if i up his dose on the weekend when i'm here, a curve would not be accurate until he's had some time to settle in. Any ideas on how to coordinate this so that i can get him more regulated sooner rather than later? Also, he is ketone negative. I have started a spreadsheet for him, but never long-term trended his numbers before finding you guys and your sheet. Please take a look and all advice is welcome. Bart is an amazingly resilient boy and he's the most awesome cat i have ever known and i want to keep him happy and around for a while, best that i can. I just feel horrible that i never looked harder for guidance and just made do on my own for soooo long :( I'm completely ashamed and had to get my courage way up to post and confess my sin of complacency. Bart deserves so much better. Thank you all in advance for caring about my sweet boy!
Thanks, Humbled-Cat
 
Good for you to take charge, Cat. Bart will be so much better for it.

I like your 2 unit dose. You have gotten some nice blue numbers at night. The 2.25 seemed to give you some low preshots and some skipped shots, which are best to avoid. Especially if the all wet diet is new (less than a week) I would stick with 2 units for at least a few more cycles.

The schedule is hard as you are away from home so much. I agree with the idea of changing doses when you will be around. For now, I would get data any time you can. Set that alarm for 6 hours after the shot and get some nadir numbers at night. Get an out the door and in the door test. Sat, Sun and Mon can be the days you really test. The more data, the better you can fine tune his dose.

Here is a document on ProZinc. Way too big to digest at one sitting, but has some information and links.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=32799

Don't waste any energy feeling guilty. The vast majority of us came on board feeding dry high carb food and never knowing we could hometest. What's important is what you will be doing for Bart now.

You might look at the PZI forum.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=24Although every cat is different, it is helpful to see others' spreadsheets and see how they adjust.
 
Thanks so much! I'll get more nighttime numbers and will browse some pzi ss.

Question about feeding - i see most folks feed equal amounts throughout the day or a big breakfast/dinner at am and pm ps and smaller snacks throughout the day. Would it make sense to feed a larger portion just at the pre-nadir feeding? I'm feeding bart every three hrs with larger am and pm ps feedings - jst because he's used to big breakfast and dinner. Also, i think his onset is more between +3-4 and nadir around 7 - so should i give him the bigger meal at +6 feeding? just an thought that maybe that would even things out as we go??

Thanks again for your reply and encouragement. Bart sends you his oh-so-excellent kitty karma!
 
Most of us feed small frequent meals during the day and some at night also. The idea is that food supports the pancreas. I use an automatic feeder and freeze the food to help with this.

Do be sure you withhold food 2 hours before you test. Food raises glucose levels and you want a number that is not influenced by food.
 
It's never too late to do better.
Hello and Welcome. You will have lots of eyes and ears here to help you think it thru and make informed decisions.
And those decisions will often be contrary to what the vet may say. But not all vets know what they are doing.

I'm not familiar with your insulin. But the motto here you already know. Go low and go slow.
Looking at your chart, I think the dose increase is what raised his numbers. They jumped.
I think you should stay with the 2.0 for at least a week and when it's time to make increases, keep them smaller , like .025 at a time and give each increase at least 3 days
to give his body time to adjust , in your case those increases would only be on the days where you can be around.
You'll just worry anyway so don't go there.

Is Prozinc the same as PZI? I truly don't know. If they are the same.....
There is a insulin support group forum that you can post daily giving your cats name and amps and other numbers so that those familiar with your insulin can help guide you.
You have to start back on the beginning page with all the options to get to it.

Don't feel guilty. None of us knew we weren't doing right by our cats just on the food issue alone until we got here. This is the learning curve site.
If the veterinarians don't know better, how could we?
You are here now. That is what matters. You are committed to helping him get better and that's all you can do.

And now you'll have cheerleaders to back you up. :RAHCAT


I wouldn't withhold the food for the tests but instead make sure to re-arrange the schedule so that it isn't feeding time 2 hrs before the AMPS.
I was testing an hour after feeding and it seems to have made my numbers around a 100 higher.
Sometimes it might not work out since you have a rough work schedule, just know that your numbers may be a little higher and footnote it on the side that ....oops,
my timing was off on the eating and testing.
I say that because you said he wasn't getting enough nutrition and I would think that would be just as important until he catches up.

That's my opinion only. I'm sure those who have done this a lot longer may differ.
So please take that into account.
 
Thanks for all the info and advice!
So I kept the 2u dose for a few more cycles and he stayed in the pink. His PU/PD increased significantly too. So, today I went to 2.5, which had given better numbers before, then shot up - a bounce maybe?
Keep in mind he was on 6 u just a couple weeks ago till he hypo'd, which is where my spreadsheet starts...
The hypo happened about a week after we went to only can food. it was caused by an amazing amount of vomit the night before which i did not know about till morning, and bart is not one to ever vomit. I had given him friskies beef pate, so maybe it was the beef. we're staying away from beef from now on.
I updated my spreadsheet, but wont be able to do an actual curve till this weekend. I understand it can take several days for him to settle into a dose. Question - here people talk in number of 'cycles' - Is a cycle one shot/curve = 12 hrs, or is a cycle a 24 hr period? So, since i just upped his dose this morning, and i plan to do a curve on sunday, that would be 3 full days = 6 doses the same in a row (assuming no ns days). Will that be a decent measure of his curve on the new dose?

I plan to get Bart's info / profile built this weekend and will also post on PZI board at that time.
Thanks!! :smile:
 
A cycle is the 12 hours from shot to shot. Yes, I think more data will help you decide whether and how much to increase the dose, which you could do this weekend.

You're doing very well. - what a lot you have accomplished and learned in a few days!
 
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