Advice - Newly Diagnosed

[Chubba’s Mom]

Hi everyone. I’ve been lurking this forum for a few days and I’ve finally decided to join and post. I may get a little long winded but I just need some advice or words of encouragement, if possible.

I originally had three cats, a girl (Zsa Zsa, 8) and two Maine Coon boys (Chubba and Mookie, 10). My boys had their annual check up in April and Chubba had a slightly elevated blood sugar level of 197 but still in normal range.

Zsa Zsa was diagnosed with asthma last year and unfortunately passed away towards the end of July which was three days before the second anniversary of my dad’s death. Three weeks after that I noticed Chubba’s back legs were weak so I took him to the vet last Tuesday. The vet informed me that he had diabetes and his blood glucose level was 591. He’s been on Lantus insulin twice a day and I give him 2mL. His new food is the Purina Pro Plan DM that he seems to love. He gets about three tablespoons of wet food for breakfast and dinner. I give him about half a cup of dry food for the day.

He seems to be doing better but I’m struggling mentally. It’s hard because my boys share everything and now they can’t share food and they like to eat together. When I first gave Chubba his shots he didn’t seem to care but I know he’s feeling better because now he doesn’t want to take his shots. I feel like I’m stressing him out and I know I’m stressed because I can’t imagine losing another family member again.

I get frustrated when I try to give him his shots and to be honest yesterday morning I yelled at him because it took me 45 min to give him his shot. I was late for work and I have other things going on and my brother does not help me. Today I tried to test Chubba’s glucose with the meter but he hates it and I have not been able to get enough blood from his ear. This was only the second time I’ve tried because I feel like I stress him out when I prick his ear.

A couple days ago his legs looked like they were getting stronger but ever since I yelled at him they seem weak again. I don’t know if it’s that or the couple time I caught him sneaking eating his brothers food. He only likes the Greenies snacks and I haven’t been giving them because I don’t want to throw off his blood sugar levels. I’ve dried the freeze dried ones and he doesn’t like human food. It sucks because he’s food motivated but I have no food to motivate him with.

Now I’m worried about his hind legs and I feel like I had a huge part in this set back. I feel completely defeated and I don’t know what else to do. I feel horrible for yelling at him.

I just don’t know what else to do.

 

[Acadaca]

Welcome to the board. I am sorry you've had such a stressful time. It sounds like you've had a lot on your plate.

First, I do not think you yelling has anything to do with the strength of his legs. We all get frustrated and you should try not to be so hard on yourself because I know it makes everything feel worse. When I was first on this board I was frustrated and scared and totally lost. I woke up crying a few times. I was not coping that well. I found that posting here and reading (and then rereading so many times) all the information helped calm me down a little. The support that people on here offer is amazing and you should lean into it because I truly believe it is what kept me from totally losing it.

Have you tried turning the noise off on your meter? When I got a new one I managed to turn it off and I don't even know if it made a difference, but it made me feel better. I know that for me I would never have been able to get any blood without using a microwaved rice bag. FCC is also very food motivated and I was lucky in that he likes the freeze dried treats, but he absolutely loves the beef liver ones. I don't know if you've tried multiple types of treats, but I was surprised by the difference in reaction. I felt terrible for taking away his other treats and he used to lay in front of where I kept the dried food and treats and just look at me pitifully. I have two cats as well and I ended up switching them both to wet food. I still sneak my other cat bits of dried treats here and there. They were both so used to having kibble to graze on and I felt so guilty for quite awhile, but everyone seems to have adjusted. I know some people also use bits of cooked meat as a treat and motivator.

There are a lot of helpful tips for ear testing that other members have passed along. I will try and link some of them to you, but thought I would reply first. It is true what they say about ear pokes and how the more you do it, the more easily the ear bleeds. Just remember you are doing this all for the health of Chubba and that I am sure he senses how much you love him.

Ask lots of questions whenever you have them because people here do care and will take the time to answer you.

 

[Acadaca]

There is lots of information in the healthlinks forum and I would definitely recommend going over the one for new members. https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/new-how-you-can-help-us-help-you.216696/

@FarmKitty posted this picture in my first forum post to help show me the best place to draw blood from FCC's ears. People also suggest that you use a flashlight or headlamp so you can look at the change in the veins of the ear after warming them up.

If you have any questions I can look for the links in the forums for you. Rather than throw a bunch of information on here maybe it would be easier for you if we answered the questions as you go.

I hope that eventually this board can help you from feeling so overwhelmed.

 

[Chubba’s Mom]

Thank you so much! It is a lot and I’ve been reading up on FD quite a bit. There just so much information! I guess I’m just worried about his levels and his little legs. He used to jump up on my bed and desk a lot and he hasn’t in the last two days but before that he felt well enough to do so.

The meter I have is the iPet Pro. The noise of that doesn’t seem to bother him. He doesn’t like his ears touched. I’ve been petting his ears more often and he tolerates it. The first time I tried to prick him I didn’t get any blood. When I tried earlier today I got some blood but not enough to feed the testing strip.

I’ll look for the beef liver treats. I don’t think he’s had that flavor before. I tried getting duck ones and he just looks at me lol

My main question is how long does it take to regulate him? I’m worried about permanent damage to his legs.

Edit: Other than treats how can I get him used to the syringe? I tried hiding it from him but he would run. Now I show it to him and give him some head scratches but he still flinches when I pinch the skin to give him the medicine. I just gave him his nightly dose and he did really good but I think it was mainly me not being upset. He hates his shot but I think he knows it makes him feel better.

 

[Bron and Sheba (GA)]

Hi and welcome to the forum
It would be helpful to us if you could set up your signature which will tell us a bit about Chubba.
HERE. Is a link which has how to set up your signature, spreadsheet, hypo box and other useful information for new members.
Once we have some more information and blood glucose data on Chubba, we will be able to help you a lot more.

It sounds as if Chubba has diabetic neuropathy, which a lot is diabetic cats get. My Sheba had is quite badly and couldn’t jump up on the bed, walk up stairs well, slipped and slid on the floors and had to sit down every few steps when she walked.. I gave her Zobaline which you can get from lifelink. It is methyl B12 tablets. You don’t get them from the vet and it is a specific vitamin B.
Once Chubba is in better numbers and with the help of the zobaline, he should improve. Sheba recovered fully from the neuropathy. It took about 6 or 8 months.

lol
My main question is how long does it take to regulate him? I’m worried about permanent damage to his legs.

Very cat is different but don’t expect immediate results. It takes time for the insulin to work as it is a hormone not a medication like an antibiotic.
The best things you can do to help him are to be hometesting the BG which you are doing….Keep persevering, make sure you are feeding a low carb diet, check for ketones in the urine, make sure he is eating well and follow one of our dosing methods.

If you set up the spreadsheet and fill in the data you already have, we can help you with dosing. We have two dosing methods and you can follow one of those with our help.
I’m going to give you a link to suitable canned foods for diabetic cats……look for foods 10% or under…..most feed around 5%. I’m not sure the food you are feeding at the moment is low carb….I’m pretty sure it is about 14% @Bandit's Mom ….I have a mental block here with the carb content of the DM …am I correct?
Set up your hypo box.
Ask lots of questions and expect that it will take a while foe you to learn all about diabetes. Don’t be hard on your self.
FOOD CHART

 

[Acadaca]

I'm glad @Bron and Sheba (GA) jumped in because I don't have any experience with diabetic neuropathy. I did notice that once FCC started feeling better he was jumping places that he hadn't in a long time. Maybe I missed something that was going on with him. Clearly you are paying attention to all the details which is going to help Chubba.

I don't know anything about the iPet pro meter, but you will notice that most people on here use one made for humans and much of the advice is tailored to those numbers.

I suspect that when you are shooting the insulin it isn't hurting him at all, but he is just flinching like any of us would if someone poked us. Sometimes when FCC got his insulin he wouldn't even notice because he was eating or distracted, but if he was aware something was going to happen it would just give him a slight edge and he would jerk a bit. I think it is probably ten times harder on us than it is them. Does he like being brushed? Is there a particular place you can take him and position you can put him in that will help establish a routine?

It took me so long to get my head on straight, but eventually some of the things became easier. I had to ask a billion questions and was always welcomed with endless patience. There are still so many things that I don't understand, but I do know that you have found the best place for both you and Chubba.

As a side note, when I mentioned that FCC loved beef liver I forgot to say that his counterpart has absolutely zero interest in it and would turn her nose up every time. She also liked the freeze dried chicken so there is a good chance there is a flavour our there that your cat will like.

 

[Chubba’s Mom]

Oh wow! I wasn’t aware it took that long for neuropathy recovery. I couldn’t find any information on the recovery time online. That makes me feel better because I thought I was going to see an improvement already. Well, actually I do but I think when he’s feeling up to it he jumps around a lot. The past couple days he was very mobile and running around. He may have tired himself out because today he just wants to lay down. I do try to have him walk around a little before feeding just to get some exercise. I’m not sure if that helps with his legs or not.

I actually haven’t been able to test his blood glucose at home. I only have the results from the vet. I’ve been having trouble getting enough blood from his ear. Earlier I managed to get more blood but not enough for the test. I think if I find some low carb treats for him he will tolerate it better. I’ve been touching his ears more when I pet him so he can get used to it.

He has been responding to the food well. He likes it. I read on here Fancy Feast is really good but when I first adopted Chubba the Fancy Feast never kept him full enough and gave him digestive issues. He’s been on vet prescribed food for six years since it agrees with his tummy more. Before he was on the Hill’s Prescription Metabolic diet food. He was overweight before but since he’s lost weight due to his condition he’s at the perfect weight now. I’ve been monitoring his food like crazy because I have to get his muscle mass up a bit more.

I check his urine for ketones about 2-3 a week. They’ve all been negative.

I did take a look at that signature page. It’s a little confusing but I’ll add it once I learn some more. Thanks for the chart! I was going to create one myself but this is much easier.

 

[Bron and Sheba (GA)]

actually haven’t been able to test his blood glucose at home. I only have the results from the vet. I’ve been having trouble getting enough blood from his ear. Earlier I managed to get more blood but not enough for the test. I think if I find some low carb treats for him he will tolerate it better. I’ve been touching his ears more when I pet him so he can get used to it.

Dio you warm the ears before hand with a rice sock. Put some rice into the toe of a sock and warm it for a few seconds in the microwave.test it first to see it is not too hot.
Milk the ear towards the top to encourage the blood to the area.
If you give him a treat as you are doing it, it should distract him long enough to get the blood. Have you looked at the freeze dried snacks available?

If you need any help with the spreadsheet I can tag @Bandit's Mom for you

There are lots of other foods if you don’t want to use the fancy feast.
Sheba lost a lot of her muscle mass but once she was bette regulated she eventually regained it all back. Even the vet was surprised.

 

[Diane Tyler's Mom GA]

I did take a look at that signature page. It’s a little confusing but I’ll add it once I learn some more. T

Go all the way up top to you name tap on it and a drop box will appear , you will see the word signature, tap that and just add all your information about Chubba and hit save.
If you are still having trouble we can have someone help you just ask
Take a look at my signature all about Tyler
When doing yours just be sure to include the DKA
Add info we need to help you:

• Caregiver & kitty's name
• DX: Date
• Name of Insulin (do not include dose or frequency)
• Name of your meter
• Diet: "LC wet" or "dry food" or "combo"
• Dosing: TR or SLGS or Custom (if applicable)
• DKA or other recent health issue (if applicable)
• Acro, IAA, or Cushings (if applicable)
• Spreadsheet link. Please put the signature link on the bottom line of your signature information, on its own, so it is easy to find.

 

[Diane Tyler's Mom GA]

For the neuropathy you can use this, it's much much cheaper than Zobaline
I have used it myself and so have many members, One per day just open up the capsule and sprinkle it on his wet food, always add water to his wet food also.
It's tasteless. Once you get Chubba regulated plus giving the Methyl B-12 you will see an improvement. You can start the MethylB-12 now
I started seeing an improvement in Tyler in about 2-3 months.
He's back to jumping on things and running around




https://www.vitacost.com/vitacost-vitamin-b-12-methylcobalamin-5000-mcg-100-capsules-6

 

[Mocha's_mom]

I'm still new here too and I know how overwhelming it can be. It took me so many tries before I could get Mocha's ear to bleed. So many tears and lots of frustration!! I thought he'd never bleed. The good news is that it does get easier because they will begin to form more capillaries after poking so many times and the bleeding will come. Mocha's ears are black so I was so frustrated searching for a tiny dark red drop of blood on black fur. I ended up buying a set of eye glasses with a magnifying glass and spotlight so I could see what I was doing. Helped tremendously. Another thing I do is use 26g lancets for pricking. The lower the number the fatter the needle. I was scared the larger needle would hurt him but actually it makes the whole process so much easier on both of us! Using a smaller lancet I was poking several times and getting nothing. And by then Mocha was already trying to get the heck outta there. And always make sure the ear is warm. I've never used the sock method, just rub my fingers on it a little and it's usually fine. He's indoor only so he's warm most of the time anyway.
He's very food motivated and likes deli meat. So now I just take out the package of ham and lay it right in front of him as I gather all my "gear". It's taken me a couple weeks to gain enough confidence to prick his ear (without my hands shaking), slide the test strip into the meter only after I see blood, then get the sample. I don't know about the iPet pro meter, but look on the box and see how much blood it requires. Different meters require different amounts of blood. I use the alphatrak meter that only requires 0.3 microliters of blood. I think that's one of the lowest out there. Be careful because some meters can go as high as 1 microliter (which is a lot of blood). I keep the test strip in the meter about halfway and once I see blood then I push it in all the way. Otherwise you run the risk of the meter timing out by the time you get blood.
When it comes to the insulin I'm using the smallest possible needle I could find. Initially I was using what the vet gave me 29g 1/2" needle which is pretty small, but Mocha was always yelping & trying to get away when I gave the shot. I've since purchased a 31g 5/16" needle and he barely notices it. I usually do it close to the scruff area between the shoulders and that seems to be the best spot for him. Sometimes I do the flank area to mix it up a bit but he always meows there. I try to just sneak up behind him when he's eating a treat to give him the insulin. Just make it one swift movement. Have one finger on the plunger and the other fingers holding the syringe. Make the "tent" with one hand and jab with the other. The more time you fuss with him (yanking on the skin, getting in position) the more time he has to decide to run.
Trust me it takes lots of practice, lots of tears and frustration but it will get easier!!

And always make sure you've had your morning coffee (if you're a coffee drinker) before you attempt any of this. One of my first days I was so anxious to begin the "process" and tried before I had my coffee. Needless to say I spent the whole morning crying out of frustration! Always make sure you are in a good frame of mind. Cats definitely feel our fear and anxiety and it makes everything harder. And if you don't get the blood the first time, take a break and try again in 15-30 mins.

I can't speak for the diabetic neuropathy because I have no experience but I can tell you that yelling was not the impetus. Once his sugars get normalized it will hopefully resolve itself.

It gets easier I promise!! We've all been in your shoes. Go easy on yourself. It's scary and difficult in the beginning but it will get better.

 

[Sienne and Gabby (GA)]

Welcome to FDMB.

You've gotten some great information! I suspect pretty much everyone gets frustrated with home testing at the beginning of this process. It does take a little while for the capillary bed in your cat's ear to develop. Using a wider gauge lancet is a great strategy when you're starting out. Once Chubb's ears are more accustomed to the you're poking and getting blood, you can. use a thinner lancet.

Using a thinner gauge insulin syringe is also helpful I used a 30 or 31 gauge needle. Your syringes should also be marked in half unit increments. There is a great deal of information about Lantus and its use in the sticky notes at the top of the Lantus/Basaglar/Levemir page.

When my kitty was diagnosed, I was getting myself in a twist over how to feed Gabby her prescription food vs what I was feeding my kitten. Someone here pointed out that the prescription food was less than ideal and there was no reason to give the cats different food. A low carbohydrate diet is species appropriate for all cats. Cats are obligate carnivores -- their bodies do not process carbs very well. There are only one or two dry foods that are low in carbs. The other issue with a dry food is that it's lacking in moisture. Cats have a low thirst drive. They need water not only to not become dehydrated but to keep their kidneys working well. Since diabetes is hard on the kidneys, feeding your cat canned food is much better for overall health. This is a link to an excellent website on feline nutrition that you may find interesting.

The neuropathy will improve once Chubba is better regulate and with giving him methylcobalamin (methyl-b12). There is a product, Zobaline, that is formulated for cats and is available on Amazon. It is a bit pricer than buying generic methylcobalamin. (You don't want plain B-12. It's generally cyanocobalamin which isn't as effective.)

As others noted, treats help a LOT when it comes to testing. Many people use a freeze dried protein. An alternative is something like cooked chicken. One of our members would buy frozen, cooked shrimp and defrost one or two and use a small piece as a treat. Other members' cats loved to be brushed and that was a "treat." In other words, reward your cat for putting up with your successful or unsuccesful poking with whatever treat Chubba likes.

You are also absolutely correct -- there is a lot of information to absorb and it's completely overwhelming. And like Christina said above, it gets easier. The people here are very generous with their time and their knowledge. Please ask questions. We're here to help.

 

[Chubba’s Mom]

Thank you everyone. You all have been a great help. I actually managed to finally sleep through the entire night last night. Chubba seems more relaxed for his shot now I guess since I’m more relaxed. I did notice once I refill the water bowl with cold water he likes to walk over there to get his shot.

Before I bought it the iPet Pro said it takes less blood. I’m not sure how much I would have to check. He’s an indoor cat so his ears are usually warm but I warm them up with a paper towel with warm water. He doesn’t mind that he doesn’t like for me to hold his ear. When I was finally able to prick him before I couldn’t see the blood since he’s a black cat. I tried it in the hallway because he likes to lay there.

The pharmacy I get the insulin at have been really helpful. They helped me with Zsa Zsa and with Chubba’s needles I have the 31g 5/16” needles.

I haven’t tried brushing him before his shot. I’ll try that. I usually give the shot after his wet food. He likes to snack throughout the day because when I adopted him he had came from two hoarding homes and wasn’t able to eat really so he likes to know there’s food available. I don’t leave the dry food out anymore. I give him a tablespoon or so at a time because he gets 1/2-3/4 cup a day.

 

[Mocha's_mom]

When I was finally able to prick him before I couldn’t see the blood since he’s a black cat.

I had the same issue with Mocha and his black ears. I found these magnifying glasses with a light on Amazon and they helped tremendously! In the beginning I knew I was getting blood because I'd see it on the cotton ball I was holding behind his ear but I couldn't see it on the black fur! Once I got a magnifier & light it made a world of a difference!

 

[Lando demando]

Hello Chubbas mom!

i am a newbie myself and can not give any helpful hints as of yet, but i wanted to offer my well wishes and support. I also lost one of my three cats at the start of the pandemic to kidney disease. So i reacted a lot like you described when my guy lando was diagnosed. Sending you a lot of understanding, compassion and well wishes for chubba!

 

[Chubba’s Mom]

Hello Chubbas mom!

i am a newbie myself and can not give any helpful hints as of yet, but i wanted to offer my well wishes and support. I also lost one of my three cats at the start of the pandemic to kidney disease. So i reacted a lot like you described when my guy lando was diagnosed. Sending you a lot of understanding, compassion and well wishes for chubba!

Thank you so much! I lost a cat years ago from kidney disease.

It’s definitely a lot of information and everyone has been really supportive and helpful on here. It’s just hard sometimes because people like to tell you it’s just a cat but these are my babies!!

Chubba and I have been doing a lot better with his shots. I let him let me know when he’s ready. He knows it’s helping him feel better but he still doesn’t like it lol

 

[Lando demando]

i completely agree, not everyone understands the bond that exists for many people and their non human pals. There is nothing wrong with caring deeply for another being! All the best to you and Mr Chubba.

and yes, Lando and I are BOTH getting used to shot and testing also ha!

 

[Chubba’s Mom]

Hello. I just wanted to give an update on Chubba. He’s been doing pretty well since the last time I posted. He tolerates his shot but becomes a brat on the days he feels really well cause he thinks he doesn’t need it lol. He has even been jumping on my bed a few times!

I’m still working on testing his blood sugar levels at home. I still haven’t been able to find any treats he actually likes because I think that will make him tolerate the pricking of his ear.

I have encountered a problem I haven’t been in before. Chubba hasn’t eaten much of his dinner so tonight so I’m not going to give him his shot just to be safe. He’s been drinking normally although he hasn’t eaten as much as he has lately. The only thing is different is that he threw up a pretty big hairball this morning and ever since then he’s been eating but not the normal amount. I give him dry food throughout the day. He ate like half of the dry food I give him for the day and half of the wet food for dinner.

He is going to see the vet this week to see how he’s doing on his insulin and if anything needs to be adjusted. I just don’t know if it’s normal for him to eat less some days. I do know he eats less when he throws up a hairball because he hates throwing up. It’s just a tad scary since he’s diabetic now.

 

[Lando demando]

Hello. I just wanted to give an update on Chubba. He’s been doing pretty well since the last time I posted. He tolerates his shot but becomes a brat on the days he feels really well cause he thinks he doesn’t need it lol. He has even been jumping on my bed a few times!

I’m still working on testing his blood sugar levels at home. I still haven’t been able to find any treats he actually likes because I think that will make him tolerate the pricking of his ear.

I have encountered a problem I haven’t been in before. Chubba hasn’t eaten much of his dinner so tonight so I’m not going to give him his shot just to be safe. He’s been drinking normally although he hasn’t eaten as much as he has lately. The only thing is different is that he threw up a pretty big hairball this morning and ever since then he’s been eating but not the normal amount. I give him dry food throughout the day. He ate like half of the dry food I give him for the day and half of the wet food for dinner.

He is going to see the vet this week to see how he’s doing on his insulin and if anything needs to be adjusted. I just don’t know if it’s normal for him to eat less some days. I do know he eats less when he throws up a hairball because he hates throwing up. It’s just a tad scary since he’s diabetic now.

Im sure youve tried it all chubbas mom, but in case you havent… inaba churu snacks worked with lando and my other cat when nothing else would!
Of course check with the experienced members for nutrition ( im still learning)
Good luck and well wishes to Chubba!

 

[Chubba’s Mom]

Im sure youve tried it all chubbas mom, but in case you havent… inaba churu snacks worked with lando and my other cat when nothing else would!
Of course check with the experienced members for nutrition ( im still learning)
Good luck and well wishes to Chubba!

OMG! Thank you!!! I have lickable treats from before and they aren’t grain free. He loves those! I’m going to buy some!

 

[Lando demando]

OMG! Thank you!!! I have lickable treats from before and they aren’t grain free. He loves those! I’m going to buy some!

I think some have tapioca as an ingredient? Some more seasoned members may have ideas on whether they are for special occasions or often!

 

[Chubba’s Mom]

I think some have tapioca as an ingredient? Some more seasoned members may have ideas on whether they are for special occasions or often!

It’s hard for me to read the ingredients cause I get confused lol I bought a variety pack from the dollar store a while back and the ingredients just say tuna/chicken/salmon broth, salmon, carrageenan, fish hydrolyzate and taurine. Like I have no idea what that means lol

 

[Chubba’s Mom]

Im sure youve tried it all chubbas mom, but in case you havent… inaba churu snacks worked with lando and my other cat when nothing else would!
Of course check with the experienced members for nutrition ( im still learning)
Good luck and well wishes to Chubba!

I just wanted to thank you so much for the treat suggestion. I was finally able to order them and they were delivered today. I put some on a plate and he didn’t even care about getting his shot. I even practiced pinching his skin and he didn’t even flinch! It was so cute because he was purring too.

I’m crying happy tears because he gets grumpy around shot time and all the treats I’ve tried he doesn’t like and I can’t give him the normal ones I have. The past couple days have been hard because he’s literally been running away from me or swiping at me which he doesn’t do so I’m so grateful. Thank you again

 

[Lando demando]

I just wanted to thank you so much for the treat suggestion. I was finally able to order them and they were delivered today. I put some on a plate and he didn’t even care about getting his shot. I even practiced pinching his skin and he didn’t even flinch! It was so cute because he was purring too.

I’m crying happy tears because he gets grumpy around shot time and all the treats I’ve tried he doesn’t like and I can’t give him the normal ones I have. The past couple days have been hard because he’s literally been running away from me or swiping at me which he doesn’t do so I’m so grateful. Thank you again

I am soooooooo happy for chubba and you! I dont know what the magic of churu is… but its high making magic! All the best to you all