8/20 Khloe | AMPS 287, +2 178, +4 84, +6 76, PMPS 266

[Sara & Khloe]

Previous Post

I’m getting a little antsy for an increase. Thoughts on going to 1.75U tomorrow morning if there’s no surprises tonight?

Not much to report on except that she absolutely hates the syringes now. She was doing ok there for a few days but she runs the second she sees me with the syringe now. She used to be so distracted with food and never reacted but I think she’s just had enough of it. I’m sorry Khloe, I promise I don’t want to do it either!!

One other question today, I use a 10mL vial because my vet refuses to prescribe the pens. I’ve been using it for almost 3 months now, it will be obvious if it looses its effectiveness before 6 months right? How would one know the difference between insulin going bad vs the kitty needing an increase? Not that I think my vial is bad or anything, just curious.

May all the kitties have safe surfs, finish all their food, and sit still for testing today! Have a great day everyone

 

[Connie & Parker & Moonie]

Oh poor Khloe

I do the same thing too when Moonie gets cranky about the ear pokes. I don’t want to do them either!

I do think our babies know deep inside that we do it because it’s important and we love them. At the end of the day Khloe still lets you do the shots. You use 8mm right? Moonie used to really fight me when I had a longer needle and didn’t know that 8mm options existed.

I have no idea about the vials but for the pens, as soon as I see anything floating or the color clarity being off, I toss the pen. I admit though that I get paranoid assuming it’s the pen’s fault when Moonie’s numbers are bad and I’ve probably wasted several pens this way

 

[tiffmaxee]

I had two vials. They lasted about 5 months each. Ask you vet why? You use the pens just like a vial. Makes no sense.

 

[Sara & Khloe]

I had two vials. They lasted about 5 months each. Ask you vet why? You use the pens just like a vial. Makes no sense.

Thank you, that’s good to know!

He’s uncomfortable with the idea of inserting a syringe into a pen. He’s a fairly new vet and seems to go by the book. I really try to pick my battles with him, so pen/vial didn’t feel like the hill to die on.

 

[Marje and Gracie]

Previous Post

I’m getting a little antsy for an increase. Thoughts on going to 1.75U tomorrow morning if there’s no surprises tonight?

Not much to report on except that she absolutely hates the syringes now. She was doing ok there for a few days but she runs the second she sees me with the syringe now. She used to be so distracted with food and never reacted but I think she’s just had enough of it. I’m sorry Khloe, I promise I don’t want to do it either!!

One other question today, I use a 10mL vial because my vet refuses to prescribe the pens. I’ve been using it for almost 3 months now, it will be obvious if it looses its effectiveness before 6 months right? How would one know the difference between insulin going bad vs the kitty needing an increase? Not that I think my vial is bad or anything, just curious.

May all the kitties have safe surfs, finish all their food, and sit still for testing today! Have a great day everyone

Looks to me like you have room to increase by 0.25u as long as you can keep that testing up to catch the lows. She’s been at this dose a while and she’s mostly hitting 70s and above.

I truly do not understand vets that won’t keep up with things or not receptive to different ways of doing things. Have you asked him why he won’t prescribe the pens? Have you explained to him that we are drawing from it like a vial so that you aren’t just dialing in a dose and that it’s very accurate plus costs less. Perhaps take him some of the info from our stickys. You could even pick a SS from a well regulated cat here where the CG is using pens and show him the SS. He’d probably freak out at the normal numbers.

 

[Staci & Ivy]

Good luck if you increase Sara.
I’m sorry Khloe isn’t thrilled with the syringes.

I agree with everyone, pens are nothing unusual but they just aren’t familiar.

I just ask my vet for what I’d like to buy. I ask them nicely to write the script to read a box of 5 Solostar pens.
They don’t seem to care that I like the pens over the vials.
I hope eventually they just give you what’s best for you

 

[Seth&Bell]

Good luck with the increase if you take it, Sara! I'm sorry about the syringe fear. I'm having to pill Blair twice a day, and she's now very skittish around me, which I hate.

 

[Sara & Khloe]

Looks to me like you have room to increase by 0.25u as long as you can keep that testing up to catch the lows. She’s been at this dose a while and she’s mostly hitting 70s and above.

Thank you Marje! I feel comfortable with my testing routine so I can stay with it. She’ll probably be dramatic tonight and nadir at 50 or something just to prove me wrong! Lol

I truly do not understand vets that won’t keep up with things or not receptive to different ways of doing things. Have you asked him why he won’t prescribe the pens? Have you explained to him that we are drawing from it like a vial so that you aren’t just dialing in a dose and that it’s very accurate plus costs less. Perhaps take him some of the info from our stickys. You could even pick a SS from a well regulated cat here where the CG is using pens and show him the SS. He’d probably freak out at the normal numbers.

I don’t really get it either. He’s more the type to tell me no if I ask permission to do something, but accepts it if I just do it and show him good results. I honestly think Khloe might be his first FD patient as he mostly talks about dogs he’s treated. He also treats horses so maybe he’s stretched thin, idk.
I’ve explained how it’s possible to draw from a pen, he’s been impressed with the organization skills from the SS, he’s happy with her glucose numbers from the dosing advice here. But still stubborn when I suggest anything he’s not familiar with I just have to chuckle at the backwardness of it sometimes. I kinda think he’s nervous to do something wrong. I don’t necessarily have a problem with the vial tho so it’s not a huge deal to me, plus with the pen shortage it’s nice to know I have a vial script if I need it. I can push harder for pens if the vial ever becomes an issue.

 

[Wendy&Neko]

What gauge needle is on the syringes that you are using? Just wondering if there is a narrower one you can use. One of the reasons I was so happy to switch from Caninsulin to Lantus was the U-40 syringes we were using had thicker needles.

Way back in 2012, it was the pharmacist where I got Neko's first Lantus who suggested it would be better to get cartridges instead of a vial. Cartridges are like pen refills that you can get in Canada. This is 2026!! So much for the vet school where your "fairly new vet" trained. How about saying "all my friends with diabetic cats use pens"? Can't remember what, but I remember using that phrase successfully about something or other with my vet.

Good luck with the increase.

 

[Sara & Khloe]

Good luck if you increase Sara.
I’m sorry Khloe isn’t thrilled with the syringes.

I agree with everyone, pens are nothing unusual but they just aren’t familiar.

I just ask my vet for what I’d like to buy. I ask them nicely to write the script to read a box of 5 Solostar pens.
They don’t seem to care that I like the pens over the vials.
I hope eventually they just give you what’s best for you

Thank you Staci! I really hope she comes around to injections again and not be so scared but that’s gonna take a lot of time and pets to get there. I just wish she could understand that I’m sorry

Worst case scenario I can always switched to a different vet in the same clinic if I ever need pens and he refuses. I’m just hoping if I need them that he’ll trust me and maybe even learn something new from Khloe for the next kitty he treats!

Give your fluffy queen some extra love from me!

 

[Sara & Khloe]

Good luck with the increase if you take it, Sara! I'm sorry about the syringe fear. I'm having to pill Blair twice a day, and she's now very skittish around me, which I hate.

That makes me so sad Poor kitties don’t know what’s happening. I wish they would let us help them without being scared.

 

[Marje and Gracie]

Thank you Staci! I really hope she comes around to injections again and not be so scared but that’s gonna take a lot of time and pets to get there. I just wish she could understand that I’m sorry

Worst case scenario I can always switched to a different vet in the same clinic if I ever need pens and he refuses. I’m just hoping if I need them that he’ll trust me and maybe even learn something new from Khloe for the next kitty he treats!

Give your fluffy queen some extra love from me!

Are you using 31g syringes?

 

[Sara & Khloe]

What gauge needle is on the syringes that you are using?

Are you using 31g syringes?

Mine are the UltiCare 31g and are 8mm. Same ones I’ve used since starting Lantus. Do they get any thinner?

Way back in 2012, it was the pharmacist where I got Neko's first Lantus who suggested it would be better to get cartridges instead of a vial. Cartridges are like pen refills that you can get in Canada. This is 2026!! So much for the vet school where your "fairly new vet" trained. How about saying "all my friends with diabetic cats use pens"? Can't remember what, but I remember using that phrase successfully about something or other with my vet.

Should I really push for the pens then? I thought it was mostly a price thing that made the pens/carts better.

And he graduated in 2024 so long past 2012! I can hound him for pens if I need too, or I can switch to a different vet same clinic. They have 6 to choose from, and one has been practicing since 1993. I have 2-3 months to decide until the vial is empty so that gives me time to put some pressure on lol.

 

[Seth&Bell]

I don't have great advice about the pens, but I ran into some mild pushback on them when I first started. This was from the vet who was selling me hugely inflated insulin that they had packaged into a smaller vial (big thanks again to Wendy who caught that it wasn't an official vial. I believe her wording was something to the effect of "what is that thing you are drawing insulin out of ). Check out 8/29/24 on Bell's SS for an example of a bad insulin to good insulin switch.

I kinda had to earn my vet's trust that I wasn't being reckless with Bell's safety - the spreadsheet was a big part of that. Now she doesn't even ask about anything diabetes-related outside of saying how good Bell looks for a diabetic cat. She will write my scripts word for word for the pens, no question. When Bell got diagnosed with IAA, she said "if anyone had to deal with this, I'm glad it was you". Thanks? . (In reality I was very proud )

My approach would be to keep reminding him of the amount of testing you are doing and ask if he would be willing to just try the pens once. Maybe even say you'll use the vial for backup. Khloe seems consistent enough that you would notice if the pen wasn't working (not a real concern), and you could just switch back to the vial if that were the case. Again, not a real concern, but I feel it logically tracks with his mindset. IF you can convince him to get script the pens, you'll have plenty of data to show him the second time that the pens are fine.

 

[Sara & Khloe]

This was from the vet who was selling me hugely inflated insulin that they had prepackaged into a smaller vial (big thanks again to Wendy who caught that it wasn't an official vial. I believe her wording was something to the effect of "what is that thing you are drawing insulin out of ). Check out 8/29/24 on Bell's SS for an example of a bad insulin to good insulin switch.

They did WHAT?! That’s actually insane!
And ahhh I see, big difference Bell made back in 2024. That must have been terrifying so early into the diagnosis tho!

I kinda had to earn my vet's trust that I wasn't being reckless with Bell's safety - the spreadsheet was a big part of that. Now she doesn't even ask about anything diabetes-related outside of saying how good Bell looks for a diabetic cat. She will write my scripts word for word for the pens, no question. When Bell got diagnosed with IAA, she said "if anyone had to deal with this, I'm glad it was you". Thanks? . (In reality I was very proud )

My approach would be to keep reminding him of the amount of testing you are doing and ask if he would be willing to just try the pens once. Maybe even say you'll use the vial for backup. Khloe seems consistent enough that you would notice if the pen wasn't working (not a real concern), and you could just switch back to the vial if that were the case. Again, not a real concern, but I feel it logically tracks with his mindset. IF you can convince him to get script the pens, you'll have plenty of data to show him the second time that the pens are fine.

I thought I did earn his trust after he saw the SS! He even has a link to view the data live! Maybe I’ll have to remind him that he experimented with Khloe on Bexacat & Vetsulin and I didn’t fight him on it, so let me try a pen just once for SCIENCE! Lol

 

[Marje and Gracie]

Mine are the UltiCare 31g and are 8mm. Same ones I’ve used since starting Lantus. Do they get any thinner?


Should I really push for the pens then? I thought it was mostly a price thing that made the pens/carts better.

And he graduated in 2024 so long past 2012! I can hound him for pens if I need too, or I can switch to a different vet same clinic. They have 6 to choose from, and one has been practicing since 1993. I have 2-3 months to decide until the vial is empty so that gives me time to put some pressure on lol.

To me, there was much more convenience in handling a smaller pen that was hard to break. We’ve had members accidentally drop vials here and the package of pens lasts longer. I used a vial first and it didn’t last nearly as long as the pens.

 

[Mary & Jude]

Good luck with the increase!

 

[Seth&Bell]

They did WHAT?! That’s actually insane!
And ahhh I see, big difference Bell made back in 2024. That must have been terrifying so early into the diagnosis tho!


I thought I did earn his trust after he saw the SS! He even has a link to view the data live! Maybe I’ll have to remind him that he experimented with Khloe on Bexacat & Vetsulin and I didn’t fight him on it, so let me try a pen just once for SCIENCE! Lol

Bexacat was another pain point at the start for me. We decided to try out Bexacat, but I didn't realize the dangers of Bell taking that with ketones. They never mentioned I should be looking for ketones before starting it. Luckily I found this place, did a test which showed significant ketones, and let them know. They were like: oh yeah she definitely can't take that now.

I honestly don't think the insulin thing was nefarious, they were just dividing a Lantus vial into smaller vials since most cats wouldn't use a whole vial before it went bad. They just didn't have a clue that this could affect the insulin. Some other bad advice: I should roll the Lantus vial before using. Human meters aren't accurate (even though they sent Bell home with a Libre). I could use the same syringe for 2 injections.

I am painting a bad picture of my vet here, which I don't mean to. I just don't think a lot of vets have much experience at all with FD and because of that, they follow the incorrect playbook.

For SCIENCE!!

 

[Sara & Khloe]

Bexacat was another pain point at the start for me. We decided to try out Bexacat, but I didn't realize the dangers of Bell taking that with ketones. They never mentioned I should be looking for ketones before starting it. Luckily I found this place, did a test which showed significant ketones, and let them know. They were like: oh yeah she definitely can't take that now.

I didn’t know Bell tried Bexacat! They never mentioned any dangers to me either about it except “some cats may have a higher chance of DKA” which I didn’t even understand at the time. Khloe had something like 2.7 reading for Ketones at diagnosis (which now I’m suspicious of because her labs from that day show negative ) and I was still pushed to try it first, and get this. I was actively told NOT to test for Ketones at home “because most owners panic over high numbers” ??? I believe it was Bron who told me to get urine strips and that my vet didn’t have to know

I heard the same thing about human meters. He wanted me to buy a Alpha Trak and was saying “well you won’t have to test that often so it shouldn’t be too pricey” because he only wanted curves every 2 weeks and did not want me to test daily.

I’m also not trying to paint a bad picture of my vet, I’m sure he is fantastic with non-diabetic related things. But maybe one day a newbie will see our conversation and say to themselves “hey! That sounds alot like what my vet told me!” and can feel less obligated to take their vets advice without first asking questions.

I’m just grateful Bell, Khloe, and all the other kitties are still here today so we can tell these stories.

 

[Seth&Bell]

Luckily I didn’t start the bexacat. I had the bottle at home all ready to start and then did the urine test and she was 15mg/dL. They then checked with a blood test and she was 5.7 mmol/L. She was in pretty rough shape at the time and the bexacat would have been really dangerous. I’m so grateful for the folks here.

 

[Staci & Ivy]

One more thing about the pens, as Marje said above, it’s much easier to handle.
Pens can be used to the last drop (used up quicker than using a vial). If you drop one (I’ve done it) it won’t break.
(Not so good odds with a vial).
If you break a vial you’re screwed (especially if at night or weekend) and you need to get another vial asap for the next cycle shot.

What if the vet office is closed and you don’t have access to getting that prescription to the pharmacy as quickly as needed so you can give the next shot?
For me, that would make me completely unhinged. I only used a couple of vials (and at the time they were costing me $300 each vial ) until I learn learned from everyone here that pens were a much better way to go all the way around!
At this point, unless I had absolutely no alternative, I would never go back to a vial.

I really hope you can turn this guy around. It sounds like he may be an OK vet but, he sounds young and a little inexperienced from what you are saying.