7/8 Bob PMPS=211 Ketone results and PMPS??

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Lkldcatlady

Lkldcatlady

Member Since 2013
good morning! it's Monday - yuck. Trying to get motivated....hopefully the rest of you are having better luck!

bob has me worried. He's very sleepy all the time (last 3-4 days). He is eating and drinking - his pee has looked a little larger the last couple of days. He did get up once and chase Hector and he did sit in the window for a few minutes. I used a string to get him playing a little, but he just LOOKS so tired. His eyes are half open and he just lies there like a lump most of the time. I could just punch that specialist in the face for trying to tell me this cat is regulated. Sorry, don't mean to sound violent! I'm just very worried about my boo.... :sad:

is bob ready for a dose increase? should I increase him by .5 or .25?


yesterday's condo
 
Re: 7/8 Bob AMPS=308 Ready for dose increase?

Dara:

Are you able to get at least one spot check per cycle in addition to your pre-shot tests? I'm not comfortable suggesting a dose increase based primarily on pre-shot numbers. Lantus dosing is based on the nadir (lowest point in the cycle) which is typically toward the middle of each 12-hour cycle. Can you get a test in during the AM cycle today?

Just as a precaution, are you testing for ketones? There's no information about Bob's medical background in his Profile so I don't know if this is an issue.

I also want to point out that the DM dry is not low carb and is probably what is inflating Bob's numbers. I realize that a total of 2/3 of a cup of dry doesn't seem like much but it really dose have a negative impact on the BG numbers.
 
Re: 7/8 Bob AMPS=308 Ready for dose increase?

Hi Sienne - I did get a couple of numbers but I didn't have his meter here at work with me so couldn't update. I'm a bad mother!!! Anyway, from what I recall, he's in his usual straight line! I'll update the ss tonight. Can't get any this am because of work, but If I don't have good numbers at home, I'll get up tonight and get a couple.

I know his food is bad. He's just so difficult and he won't eat if I give him something else (like on the 1st when I dared to mix some YA into his food). I'm so scared he'll have other issues from not eating. I had his blood ketones checked last tuesday and I am taking him on wed morning for another check. I also bought the novamax meter so I could do the blood instead of the urine, but I won't have that for a couple of days. I have some pretty awful experiences with trying to do anything involving cat urine.

bob hasn't had any issues with ketones up to this point, but the vet said on tuesday there was a very, very tiny amount in his blood. SHe said nothing to worry about, check him in a week. Of course, she's the one who told me he was regulated so maybe I should think twice about anything she says. Maybe I'll get off early and take him today....
 
Re: 7/8 Bob AMPS=308 Ready for dose increase?

See if you can add fluid to his food (water, low sodium chicken broth, tuna juice provided it has no veggies or soy that are in the ingredients). Fluid intake can help to wash out ketones. There's also some info that Jill posted regarding measuring ketones in Tigger's condo. You may want to take a look.

Let's see what we can to to very gradually transition Bob to canned food. Some cats make the switch easily. Some are pretty stubborn. This could take weeks but let's think about a plan.

If you've got the test data, just get it on your SS by PMPS. I think Bob could stand a dose increase but I'd like to see the numbers.
 
Re: 7/8 Bob AMPS=308 Ready for dose increase?

I'm taking him to the vet at 4:15 today and see if they can either get some urine or do a blood ketone test with results immediately!

I would be happy to try any suggestions on the food - he's beyone difficult with that. If he doesn't like something (like the YA), he just won't eat it. And he had a good number (197 on the 1st) that morning but it was from not eating. I have to make sure he eats right? Or he could develop ketones?
 
Re: 7/8 Bob AMPS=308 Ready for dose increase?

Ketones don't occur just because a kitty doesn't eat. It's usually a combination of factors -- not enough insulin, not eating, and an infection/inflammation usually add up to ketones. Further, some cats just seem prone to developing them and some don't.

There are also reasons beyond ketones that make eating a priority. The most obvious is that BG numbers could tank if there's no food on board. That can make for a way too exciting cycle! Also, If a cat doesn't eat for 3+ days, the kitty can develop hepatic lipidosis ("fatty liver") which if left untreated can cause liver failure. This is why if a cat is sick, we push people to be attentive to the food issue. The illness can be a set up for both ketones and HL.

What I would suggest is finding a flavor of food that Bob will show some interest in. There are then 2 choices. Crush up some of his hard food so it's more like the hard stuff with a tiny bit of canned mixed in and do this for several days. Very, very gradually begin to alter the proportion of dry to canned. Even if this takes literally months, it's OK.

Some cats will eat anything with FortiFlora on it. FortiFlora is a probiotic. Apparently, it's flavored with the same product that forms a coating on most dried food so it's enticing to many cats. (My vet used to refer to it as "kitty crack.") You could see if Bob would accept a bit of canned food + FortiFlora as a treat.
 
Re: 7/8 Bob AMPS=308 Ready for dose increase?

I've tried mixing the wet with kibbles of dry and that did not work well, but I can try crushing it tonight and see what that does. The problem with Bob is that he will show some interest in something one time and then not again. For instance, one time, I fed him the beef FF and he ate a good little bit of it (for him - he NEVER finishes it). The next time I gave it to him, he refused to eat it, even with some tuna water on it. Same with the turkey & giblets - he showed interest in it once or twice and then sometimes he's like "no way man!". So, tonight I will give him his hard food crunched up a bit with maybe a TBS of turkey & giblets. I can even pick up some forti-flora today at the vet. What do I do if he doesn't eat it? How much time should I give him?
 
Re: 7/8 Bob AMPS=308 Ready for dose increase?

I would actually try more like a teaspoon of the canned food. Don't overwhelm him.

Also, are you free feeding Bob? Is there always dry food down. If so, put his food down for 20 min. and pick it up. You want him to be hungry at meal times.

Please take a look at Dr. Lisa's page on transitioning a cat to canned food. Depending on what you have and haven't already done, we may need to modify her approach.
 
Re: 7/8 Bob AMPS=308 Ready for dose increase?

I don't free feed - I put down 1/3 c at 7:00am and 7:00pm. Usually by 2-3 hours later it is gone. He's usually pretty hungry at meal times. That's how I was able to get him to at least lick the canned food! Before he wouldn't even touch it. I'm not sure what it is - maybe he doesn't like the texture or something. My other two like every single food I have ever tried - any type of holistic dry, any kind of canned, the young again, whatever. bob is the only strange one in the family (because I pretty much eat anything too - except okra - blech).

Thanks Sienne - I'll give the teaspoon a try! I'll keep you informed. And I'll post Bob's numbers tomorrow. Thanks!

Btw - do you pronounce your name see-en-uh? or See-an-uh?

Dara
 
Re: 7/8 Bob AMPS=308 Ready for dose increase?

Her name is just pronounced "C-N".

I think she has given you some great ideas, Dara, to gradually get Bob over to canned food. I also agree his numbers could be elevated due to the dry food. I also think it's a good idea to have the vet check his ketones. I'm surprised that any vet would say it was ok for him to have ketones and not recheck for an entire week. If he had trace ketones, she should have been following up on that daily.

I would also suggest getting some freeze dried chicken treats (Pure Bites for one but there are others. I like Whole Life but it's $$). Let him have a couple of the treats and see how he likes them. If he does, you can crush them into a powder and put them on his food.
 
Re: 7/8 Bob PMPS=211 Ketone results and BG?

Marje and Gracie said:
Her name is just pronounced "C-N".

I think she has given you some great ideas, Dara, to gradually get Bob over to canned food. I also agree his numbers could be elevated due to the dry food. I also think it's a good idea to have the vet check his ketones. I'm surprised that any vet would say it was ok for him to have ketones and not recheck for an entire week. If he had trace ketones, she should have been following up on that daily.

I would also suggest getting some freeze dried chicken treats (Pure Bites for one but there are others. I like Whole Life but it's $$). Let him have a couple of the treats and see how he likes them. If he does, you can crush them into a powder and put them on his food.
Click to expand...

Thanks Marje - I actually was pronouncing it in my head that way! :smile:

Ketones are negative. They tested them in an interesting way - the specialist does it this way. She said to draw blood, centrifuge it to get the red blood cells out and then use the serum (other stuff) to put on a urine dipstick. I did buy a novmax meter and ketone strips from amazon but I have to wait for it to arrive.

Unfortunately, I have tried the pure bites- I got chicken and the little nasty shrimp. He wouldn't eat either and actually, the other cats didn't like them either and that's weird, because they usually eat everything. Sigh.

On another note, Bob's PMPS was the lowest ever - 211! Actually, the first time I tested, he moved before I got enuf blood so I used the same strip to pull in more blood and I got 150!! I didn't feel like that could be right so I checked the other ear and got 211. What the heck. Then I checked while he was eating and got 224. I just settled on the 211, unless I should figure it a different way. Any thoughts?
 
Hi Dara,

if bob doesnt like the other treats, I know of another kind of treat you could try... they are tuna flakes.

Jupiter wouldnt eat any freeze dried treats at first - but now he loves them. Just took a couple tries giving it to him for him to decide he would atleast taste and try it.


Hope you have a good day!!
 
Another good treat that my cats go nuts for are Pet Naturals of Vermont. In stores they are about $8 but only about $4 at Vitacost. The have a very strong aroma and Tess's ears perk up as soon as i open the bag!
 
If Bob likes fish, the tuna flakes are a good suggestion. If you have an oriental grocery store nearby, tuna or bonito flakes are pretty inexpensive there.


So, what was the result of the ketone test?
 
Thanks Jamie and Ann - I'll give those treats a try. I sort of just stopped trying anything new years ago when I realized how picky Bob was. That was probably a mistake because now he's even worse! ohmygod_smile

Hi Sienne - It was a couple posts up. Maybe I'm not doing it right when I change the subject...not sure.

Anyway, ketones were negative. The way they test is to centrifuge the blood and then take the serum and put it on the urine dip stick. We got the nude color which I believe is negative (she showed me the stick but I didn't read what the color meant because she told me it was negative). I'll have the novamax in a couple of days and that will make me feel more at ease. I can check his ketones without freaking him out in the litter box.
 
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