6/20 Garfunkel +12 38, +26 60

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Phil & Garfunkel

Phil & Garfunkel

Member Since 2011
10PM EST EDIT: Subject title edited.

Last week of April - Suspect something is wrong with Garfunkel, previous diet was Newman's Own Organics chicken and salmon wet with Evo chicken and turkey dry - switch food to Evo chicken and turkey wet entirely

May 2 - Cat is diagnosed with diabetes at the Humane Society, 500+ mg/dL on fructosamine test

May 10 - Naive me thinks that with the diet change maybe his numbers will be coming down and I won't need to do anything else, second fructosamine test reveals even higher levels

May 26 - Start 2u of Lantus, twice a day (I was on vacation in California and was advised to wait until I get back)

June 6 - BG curve at vet:

7am - food
7:30am - 2u Lantus
9am - 216mg/dL
11am - 252mg/dL
1pm - 289mg/dL
3pm - 295mg/dL
5:10pm - 382mg/dL
7:15pm - 385mg/dL

I've been consistently giving him the 2u twice a day with maybe one or two missed doses a week (I live alone).

I got a newbie test kit in the mail from Lori and Tom over the weekend and finally did a successful test this morning. Pre-insulin shot, with him eating just a little (he's a nibbler, it's very frustrating), I got a reading of 38mg/dL. I thought perhaps I did something wrong, so I took it again about ten minutes later (since I'm new to this and it required multiple re-stabs of his ear) and got a 40mg/dL.

He's eating (he's always been a nibbler so this isn't strange) and not showing any symptoms of a hypo. Obviously I'm not going to give him his shot this morning and I'm also going to call the vet in a bit when they open, though I really can't miss work today. What should I do?
 
Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

Hi there!

First off, I'm no expert.. hopefully more experienced eyes will be available soon.

Obviously though you did the right thing not giving any insulin and with Garfunkel eating his
BG is bound to come up. Maybe get another reading if you can before going to work?

Bruce
 
Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

Do you have any higher carb food in the house (e.g., Fancy Feast or Friskies varieties with gravy)? If not, add a few drop of something sweet -- Karo or maple syrup, honey -- to Garfunkle's food. You don't want to leave your cat sitting in low numbers for overly long. Feed then test in 20 min. Post when you get numbers.
 
Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

Sienne and Gabby said:
Do you have any higher carb food in the house (e.g., Fancy Feast or Friskies varieties with gravy)? If not, add a few drop of something sweet -- Karo or maple syrup, honey -- to Garfinkle's food. You don't want to leave your cat sitting in low numbers for overly long. Feed then test in 20 min. Post when you get numbers.
Click to expand...

The only other food I have is the Newman's Own Organics, but I'm not sure of its carb level. The only sweetener I have is agave nectar.

I'm going to the drug store and buying control solution now to make sure I'm not doing anything wrong and the readings are accurate since I'm new to all of this.
 
Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

oh my Phil, I can't help but think of your recent question "that does'nt happen to most cats does it"? and here on your very first test.
this situation has been caught in the nick of time....i had a feeling that dose was too high. i'm sooooo happy you are in lantus and i know you'll get all the CORRECT advice you need.
and this is really just a BUMP (meaning, Phil, i wanted to bring it to the top of the heap and get more eyes on it) please post again tonight on this very same thread ok. this is your condo for today. :razz:
Lori
and Tom
 
Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

Hi, Giving you a bump to the top again. :-D This is just why we test before we shoot. Have you tested again? Curves done at the vets are often inaccurate, because stress can elevated BG levels. @ units is a high starting point.
 
Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

Agree with all that's been said--You need to have a hypo kit(we call it) consisting of meter, strips, low carb food, med. carb food, and high carb food(will give you the link to our food lists at end), and karo syrup..I gave my cat karo this am to bring her bg number up this am to bring her up from 49 to 66 n 15 minutes.It is very effective..Ask questions, read the stickys at top of our main page, & post kitty's numbers daily--
Good luck & welcome to lantus!

here is the link to food lists: http://binkyspage.tripod.com/canfood.html
 
Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

Hi everyone,

A quick update before I go to work now (thankfully my schedule is usually very flexible so I'm just making up the hours late tonight).

I decided to bring him to the vet because his fructosamine test was due sometime this week anyway. I wanted to home test him again before leaving, but that didn't work well at all. Perhaps I had made his ears sore from the six or seven pricks this morning, but when I kept doing it (about four times this time), after each prick he would start to paw at his ear, then shake his head and shake blood all over. Good times.

So...

8AM - 38mg/dL
8:15 - 40mg/dL

At the vet using their glucometer, which they say is different because it's designed to be more accurate for pets, it was 120mg/dL at about noon. They ran a fructosamine and I'll have the results tomorrow. I was told to lower his dose to 1u, twice a day. I have to skip his night shot entirely tonight, as I won't get home from work until about 10PM and then his next shot before I leave tomorrow will be at 7:30AM. I'll try to night test his levels though. So that means no insulin at all today.

One of the nurses also gave me tips on how to home test him. They gave me some 25 gauge needles and she does it from the inside of the ear and directly into the vein going almost flat into it. Using my glucometer that yielded a 101mg/dL vs. the 120mg/dL on whatever they use in the back.

Here's hoping tonight's testing goes well. Thanks everyone.
 
Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

Phil, please be keenly aware that vet stress as a rule raises the bg count...sometimes A LOT. It cannot be trusted as accurate.
The fructosomine will be more accurate as it will give a bit of history....
Trust YOUR meter, and THIS group as your guide....I know that sounds anti-vet, but this is a whole mega-lot of cats here all on lantus and treating diabetes every day....many many more than your vet has ever likely treated in his entire career (diabetic cats)
This is really truly the place to get your dosing info and your home is really truly the place to get your accurate readings.
Lori
and Tom
 
Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

Also note that glucometers, per FDA regulations, may vary as much as 20% from a "true" reading - though with 2 back to back tests, the confidence in the result is much greater! (you use the 20% lower value from the higher test and the 20@ higher value from the lower test as the range of the true value)

That is why folks were telling you to put the juice in the food.
If he was 38mg/dL he could have been as low as 30 or as high as 45.6, both of which are very low numbers.
 
Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

On the testing....please don't do it the way they showed you. You don't want to poke the vein. Vets do it like that because they don't do it often. You want to buy some lancets....BD makes a very good lancet (or you can use the device in your glucometer kit if you prefer). Some of us manually poke with lancets, some use the lancing device.

You may want to start with a 29 gauge lancet and then once you get really good, you can get a finer one like 30 or 33 gauge. It is so much easier and kinder to the kitty then using a 25 gauge needle. You can get the BD lancets at any pharmacy I believe or you can also get Relion Lancets at Walmart much cheaper than the BDs. It's your preference and pocketbook :-D

Never poke the vein. Here is a depiction of the vein...you want to poke towards the outer edge of the ear....not the vein and not inwards of the vein. Sometimes we accidentally (when first starting) poke the vein...it will bleed like crazy. You just want a tiny drop from the edge of the ear to fill your glucometer.


We usually use a rice sock warmed for a few seconds in the microwave to warm the ear. We have a little round, hard plastic thing we put on the inside of the ear to hold Gracie's ear against and then we quickly poke and then compress her ear with a wash cloth where we poked so it stops bleeding and doesn't bruise. Some people use a tiny flashlight to put the ear on so they can see the big vein.

Be sure you give a little low carb treat like a freeze dried chicken bit and then put neosporin pain relief ointment (not cream) .....just a tiny dab...where you poked. You can wipe it off next time before you use that ear but if you don't get it all, it will help bead the blood....as long as you didn't go overboard on it.

Here's a video we used when we learned to hometest.

Home testing

Good luck and let us know what questions you have!
 

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Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

And if you should happen to poke the vein, lightly pinch the ear between your fingers for up to a minute, to help it stop. If you happen to have some folded tissue to use, so much the better - put it over the wound and pinch gently.

Watch out for a head shake - Spitzer almost always shakes his head with a large drop of blood on it, resulting in spatters on any inconvenient place you can find. Ummm ... don't wear white!
 
Re: Newbie to home testing/Lantus... just got a 38 reading

Update: So +26 and his reading just now was 60mg/dL.

This morning as per my original post, he was +12 38mg/dL.

I'm still having a really difficult time with the poking and wasted two strips because not enough blood got into them for the reading. Hopefully I get better at this.

Any advice for tomorrow morning? Assuming I can get a reading, what should I do depending on various ranges?

Thanks everyone.
 
Re: 6/20 Garfunkel +12 38mg, +26 60mg

So, to clarify. this morning was your very first pre shot reading. you've been shooting 2 units bid. this morning +12 was 38, he went to the vet and had a 100 something and now at +26 he is at 60.
WOW :shock:
 
Re: 6/20 Garfunkel +12 38mg, +26 60mg

this is a petty request but for ease of reading your subject titles maybe leave out the mg....it is taking away the drama of your numbers...........might be missed.
 
Re: 6/20 Garfunkel +12 38mg, +26 60mg

lori and tom said:
this is a petty request but for ease of reading your subject titles maybe leave out the mg....it is taking away the drama of your numbers...........might be missed.
Click to expand...

Fixed. The numbers seem to blend together without the mg in my eyes, but I'm new to all of this. :)
 
lori and tom said:
can you hang for a little bit? someone should be along soon.
Click to expand...

I'll be around for another hour or so. I'm just hoping tomorrow morning I can get the blood easily and not spend half an hour and multiple failed stabs like tonight since I have to go to work.
 
Hey Phil: what a day for your boy!!! Good that you did not shoot the 60.

Here's what we normally recommend: please post his number that you get one hour before what his normal shot time is in the morning and ask for help. So if you normally shoot at 7:30 am (for example), post his number at 6:30 am with "Help Needed" or something catchy in the subject line.

The reason we can't tell you tonight what to shoot tomorrow is we don't know where Garfunkel will go with his numbers during the night. If he's still low in the morning...great and you might not shoot again then! But if his numbers start creeping up, then the experienced east coast folks can look at it and your SS in the morning and suggest a dose. They may want you to bring his dose way down. But right now, he's doing awesome without juice.

So please be sure you have his SS current. If you are even up at 5:30, you could even post then with a number. Does that help?

Good luck! I, personally, hope he gives you another low number!!! It's wonderful when they stay like this without insulin.
 
ummm, there is no spread sheet yet. can someone help him get one up?
 
You've sure had an adventure with Garfunkel lately. 38 this morning and only 60 after +26 hours? Offhand it looks clear to me that 2 units of Lantus is way too much.

Tomorrow your kitty may have higher numbers as a result of his liver sending out extra glucose as a reaction to the low BG numbers today. The body 'thinks' it needs to raise the BG as a life saving maneuver. We call this a bounce and it usually clears after a day or so. So take this into consideration when you get a test result in the morning and try not to dose based on the 'bounce'.

You are doing great and have received lots of good advice. Post your numbers tomorrow before shooting (preferably around +11) and I'm sure someone can suggest a dose. If it was me, I'd definitely not shoot 2 units no matter what.

P.S. Welcome to the Lantus forum! :-D
 
CD and BigMac said:
You've sure had an adventure with Garfunkel lately. 38 this morning and only 60 after +26 hours? Offhand it looks clear to me that 2 units of Lantus is way too much.

Tomorrow your kitty may have higher numbers as a result of his liver sending out extra glucose as a reaction to the low BG numbers today. The body 'thinks' it needs to raise the BG as a life saving maneuver. We call this a bounce and it usually clears after a day or so. So take this into consideration when you get a test result in the morning and try not to dose based on the 'bounce'.

You are doing great and have received lots of good advice. Post your numbers tomorrow before shooting (preferably around +11) and I'm sure someone can suggest a dose. If it was me, I'd definitely not shoot 2 units no matter what.
Click to expand...

I'll have the fructosamine results tomorrow and the vet already told me to skip tonight's shot and cut the dosage to one unit. Of course, this depends on tomorrow's results if I can successfully get blood and with the advice I get here as well.

But just to clarify, since I haven't shot anything tonight either, if/when I post in the morning he'll be at about +36, not +11 as you said above (Post your numbers tomorrow before shooting (preferably around +11).

As for the spreadsheet, seems to not be working at the moment. I've tried twice and I get this message when I click "use this template":

We're sorry.
We're sorry, your spreadsheet cannot be copied at this time.
 
+36 right? i can't imagine 1 unit is safe since you will be gone for 12 hours after that...but i of course am not lantus expert so...
let's see if anyone has thoughts on that.
will you be able to test him at 6:30 instead of 7:30 so you'll have time to post and see what others think?
 
Oh oops... Of course it will be +36, sorry about that!

Sorry about the spreadsheet problems, I've heard the same complaint from several people lately. I wonder what is up with Google? It may be something that is just temporary and if you try again later it might work. I hope so.

Good luck tomorrow! It would be awesome if Garfunkel doesn't need a shot again. But that may be dreaming on my part.
 
lori and tom said:
+36 right? i can't imagine 1 unit is safe since you will be gone for 12 hours after that...but i of course am not lantus expert so...
let's see if anyone has thoughts on that.
will you be able to test him at 6:30 instead of 7:30 so you'll have time to post and see what others think?
Click to expand...

Yes, tomorrow morning will be +36. I wake up at 6 and leave at 7:30. I hope to post, it just depends on how easily (or not) I can get blood since I'm still really bad at that part. If after a half hour or so I can't get a reading, I'm going to just have to give up and try again tomorrow night.
 
Sienne and Gabby said:
You already have a Google account?

If you click on the USA Insulin Template the spreadsheet template should load in a few seconds.
Click to expand...

I have a Google account and the template loads, it just won't copy. It gives that error message.

We're sorry.
We're sorry, your spreadsheet cannot be copied at this time.
 
Marjorie and Gracie said:
Phil:

Here is the link to your SS:
https://spreadsheets0.google.com/spread ... utput=html

Go to User Profile and your signature; click on the "url" tab above and then paste the above link into that so it will look like this:

Garfunkel's SS

If you want to name it something other than Garfunkel's SS then put it in that box where I put those words.

Let me know tomorrow if that does not work.
Click to expand...

That link just brings me to a static spreadsheet page. I see no way of being able to edit it, it's like I'm just viewing somebody else's spreadsheet. Yes, I'm currently logged into my Google account.

Also, if I try the other way by following the standard instructions, then I still get that error message from yesterday when I click "Use this template."
 
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