5/21 Toeby AMPS 311, +2 198, +3 106, +4 88, +5 126, +6 167, PMPS 261, +2 265, +3 252, +4 256.

Look at your AMPS on 5/18 and 5/19. Toeby dropped around 100 points at his +2. You could see that today, too. His AMPS might have just been a bounce. It will be interesting to see what his +2 is today.
 
Laurasboyz said:
Thanks @Wendy&Neko , I am glad to hear from you... I wanted to ask you about budesonide.
I have read different threads on this topic and you had commented on a lot of them.
So between your experience, and your talking to others who had cats on budesonide, I wanted your input.

Toeby seems to be doing well on the steroids...
He had been a barfy cat much of his life, and had to go to the vet for help passing furballs a couple times.
But, the barfing got worse in the last couple years.

A couple vets, upon examining him at different times, had mentioned that his intestines felt "ropey" which might indicate neoplasia (cancer).
In November, the veterinarian of longest tenure at our clinic (40 +/- years) examined him when he had a bad bout of barfing and diarrhea and wrote:
"Ruleouts - neoplasia - bowel, or inflammatory bowel disease. Trial of prednisolone and course of metronidazole for diarrhea"
"If not responding - xrays, ultrasound, possible barium series"
"Note neoplasia of bowel difficult to detect if intraluminal"
We also talked about possible food allergies, and adding pumpkin to his diet and lots of things.
We discussed how prednisolone carried a risk of causing diabetes, but we went ahead, and Toeby did really well on it for a couple months, then he developed diabetes.
So, we switched to the budesonide... I was hoping it might mean I could regulate his BG's and maybe see his way off of insulin.
He it still (touching wood) doing great on budesonide....
He's on 1 mg a day, in either compounded tablets, or compounded chews.
He has only very, very rarely barfed, and I put it down to fur.

So!
My question is, after all that preamble... is budesonide something that normally you do a trial of, then wean off, and see if the bowel is calmer?
Or do they stay on it all their lives?
I think I read your kitty was on budesonide all her life?
Toeby has been on either the pred or the budesonide for 6 months now.
If you could share some of your experience or knowledge, I would greatly appreciate it.

I had read somewhere on the Facebook page that there is a classic cancer-related response to insulin, involving bounces, and I often wonder if that is what I am fighting with Toeby.
Did I read that right? I don't tend to trust a lot of what I read on the FB group.
If he has cancer, as many vets have suggested he might, that would not be a surprise in a 16 year old kitty.
Laura
Click to expand...

Laura, I don't have any experience with budesonide, but I've quoted you here, and I think Wendy will find you when she's on perhaps later. You can also add a question mark to your thread title. I'll try and remember a few others in the meantime to tag who may have used it in the past.
 
+6 167
Looks like I can get outside now and enjoy what is left of this lovely spring day!

Thanks @Christie & Maverick I am sure Wendy will chime in when she has a chance... I am in absolutely no rush, I just know that her name came up a lot when I searched the threads for info on that drug.
Toeby's vet, who started him on this drug, is going off on maternity leave, so I was hoping to educate myself a bit before talking to a new vet about it...
She was very open to trying it, although I don't think it has been used a lot in the practise.
Cheers!
Laura
 
Hi Laura, I did read your question from yesterday, and just got home a little while ago. Thanks to Christie for quoting it too.

What you do with meds depends on what condition the kitty has. If a cat has IBD you would treat differently than if the cat has small cell lymphoma. Both might take steroids, but with SCL it's possible to taper off after a while if kitty is in remission. To test if a cat has IBD or lymphoma, you need a biopsy, which could be either an endoscopy or a surgical biopsy, depending where the inflammation is. You also have to stop the steroid for a period of 2-3 weeks before the sampling, as the steroid can mask the issue.

Once you know which you are dealing with, you can proceed with treatment. IBD means a novel protein diet and probiotics, possibly steroids full time or during flares. SCL means steroids to start, and a low level chemo pill - the best protocol is once every two weeks. The majority of kitties go into remission on this protocol. Neko didn't, but my other two SCL cats did. But Neko also had a lot of other things going on. One of the remission kitties had his pred reduced but kept on it. Number 3 had it reduced after a couple years but also has some food allergies (probably iBD too), so needs a really low level of pred. Neko would have had to stay on it for her life, though we did reduce the dose a bit.

Having cancer has nothing to do with bounces. Cats without cancer also bounce if seeing numbers they aren't used to or dropping fast. Toeby hasn't spend any quality time in normal numbers. I wouldn't trust what you hear on some of those FB groups.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
To test if a cat has IBD or lymphoma, you need a biopsy, which could be either an endoscopy or a surgical biopsy, depending where the inflammation is. You also have to stop the steroid for a period of 2-3 weeks before the sampling, as the steroid can mask the issue. Once you know which you are dealing with, you can proceed with treatment.

Having cancer has nothing to do with bounces. Cats without cancer also bounce if seeing numbers they aren't used to or dropping fast. Toeby hasn't spend any quality time in normal numbers. I wouldn't trust what you hear on some of those FB groups.
Click to expand...

Thanks Wendy, for your response.
This info is food for thought and more complicated than I thought (of course, lol).
I have had the cats on human probiotics all along- I take them daily and I am a proponent of them for critters too as I cannot think of any food more over-processed than commercial pet food.
The novel protein I discussed with the vet in November.
I'm not inclined to put him under for a biopsy - but I will think about it.
Toeby's teeth are not great and even the vets are not that keen on putting him under for a dental either, so...
All food for thought and discussion with whatever vet ends up taking on his case when his vet is off on maternity leave.

The comments about cancer and bouncing were on the Facebook page associated with this message board, but I cannot find them again to reference them.
I had never heard of such a thing but it sounded plausible... but, I have no idea if the person who said it knew what they were talking about.

Thanks again for getting back to me - I appreciate it.
Laura
 
evening +3 252
I am going to assume the difference between 261, 265, and 252 is not enough to indicate a drop is coming...
It seems quite flat to me, and unlikely that he will go low on me tonight.
 
Sometimes flat to +2 can mean some dropping to nadir, but hard to say how quickly, which is where a +3 comes in handy. I agree with you, I don't think he's up to any shenanigans tonight.
 
Christie & Maverick said:
Sometimes flat to +2 can mean some dropping to nadir, but hard to say how quickly, which is where a +3 comes in handy. I agree with you, I don't think he's up to any shenanigans tonight.
Click to expand...

+4 256
I swear to God... this is an addiction... if I am awake, I feel like I HAVE to know what the cat's BG's are...
:facepalm:
So, I checked him one... more... time....
He's going no where fast.
Good night... for real this time... LOL
 
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