? 5/18 Feeding Inquiry

Don & Xena

Don & Xena

Member Since 2023
So. Xena switched from vetsulin to LANTUS yesterday, and we had some issues regarding starting too low etc.
Thread About that:
https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/5-18-am-ps-233-2-330-3-281-5-256-7-245.277682/

Now... we are just trying to get some data to use going forward. This post however pertains to Xena's favorite thing...FOOD!!

So I am going by 25-30 calories /lb. The Low Carb Wet FF Pate's i am feeding her are about 165-170/can. She is 14.5 lbs so at the average 27.5 cal/lb. Tha is about 400 calories, which is about 2.35 cans/day or 1.2 cans per 12 hr cycle.
I have been feeding her 1/2 can after her preshot, and giving her shot while she eats. Then I am feeding 1/3 can 2x through the 12 hour cycle trying to spread it out evenly.

Right now she will eat and eat and eat if I let her, but I realize that is because she is unregulated, and as she improves she should be less ravenous for food.
I just wanted to see if this seems like a good feeding plan or if there are any pointers anyone had.
On Vetsulin we were feeding her 1.25 cans at shot time only, and she had to wait 12 hrs for another meal, and i really felt bad.

Also would be great to get Suggestions for:
1- low carb treats for occasional feeding
2- Medium Carb treats to keep on hand to help bring low #'s up some ( I remember reading someone talking about some kind of paste in a tube for cats as a treat, not sure what that is but sounds interesting)
3 - Misc. - any suggestions that

Thanks in advance.
 
400 calories is a lot of food for a 14.5 lb cat. Neko, when she was about that weight, did fine with 220-250 calories. So did her buddy who was about the same weight. But ECID depending on a cat's metabolism and activity level. Your vet should know what an ideal weight level is for Xena. Use a scale to determine where she is and if her weight is trending where you want it to be. When during the cycle are you giving her the 2nd and 3rd feedings? Ideally it should be around onset or a bit before and the last one before nadir. After that insulin effect is waning and extra carbs will make it work harder and wear off earlier.

A couple food posts for you:
As far as treats, any all meat freeze dried treat (like PureBites or Orijen) is usually a hit with kitties. Or just bake/broil a chicken breast and cut it up into small pieces. Some cat get steak or shrimp/prawns.

I used medium carb/lowish high carb food to bring Neko's numbers up, not treats.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
400 calories is a lot of food for a 14.5 lb cat. Neko, when she was about that weight, did fine with 220-250 calories. So did her buddy who was about the same weight. But ECID depending on a cat's metabolism and activity level. Your vet should know what an ideal weight level is for Xena. Use a scale to determine where she is and if her weight is trending where you want it to be. When during the cycle are you giving her the 2nd and 3rd feedings? Ideally it should be around onset or a bit before and the last one before nadir. After that insulin effect is waning and extra carbs will make it work harder and wear off earlier.

A couple food posts for you:
As far as treats, any all meat freeze dried treat (like PureBites or Orijen) is usually a hit with kitties. Or just bake/broil a chicken breast and cut it up into small pieces. Some cat get steak or shrimp/prawns.

I used medium carb/lowish high carb food to bring Neko's numbers up, not treats.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I just woke up to test her and input #'s and saw this so I am half a sleep, so I'll probably have to revisit it whole fully awake, but as for my vet, they of course wanted me to feed Prescription food 2.5 cans a day and that was higher calories and way high carbs. I of course want to have a vet on board, but I am changing. I got the Calorie info from several sources online. Right now she is still acting like she is starving, and from what I understand, with diabetes that is because they can't make use of all those calories to turn them into energy. As we get her regulated I would imagine that will be less of an issue, so she will probably be satiated with less food. She already is less food aggressive than she was.
As for feeding times, I have been feeding with her shot, and have been kind of trying to feed her a few hrs later after taking a reading,,, my thought was that I would give the food time to digest so as to not affect the readings I am getting.
What you said about when i should be feeding w/ onset and before Nadir, but i am still trying to figure out when those are. The TR Protocol says the Nadir can be anywhere in the cycle including at preshot. From what I understand/read, onset is 1-2hrs after shot... if that is correct, maybe instead of feeding with the shot, I should feed an hour AFTER the shot? Should the meals be equally sized?
I definitely do want to feed her less, I just want to get to a place where she isn't acting like i am starving her. ( Actually, when we were on Vetsulin, I was feeding 340 cal/day, and the vet said I could take it up some if she is still really food aggressive)
A lot changed when we switched to Lantus, so i am trying to figure it out. While I was feeding I thought..."i have to ask for advice on feeding times and amounts."
 
You have to learn feeding times that work for Xena. Onset is typically 2-3 hours after the shot. Some cats (not all) dive down at onset. Steep dives can cause bounces. So for those cats, you ideally want to have fresh carbs (regular LC food) on board for then, so feed 1/2 hour before onset. With the limited data you have now, it looks like onset is after +2 and sometime before +3. If you get some +2.5 tests, and it's lower than preshot, you'll time the time down more accurately. For now, a +2 feeding would be a good start.

Once the depot fills, and her overall numbers come down so you are seeing some under 200 numbers, her nadir time will become clearer. Typical nadir is +6, so final feed should be before then, until you get more data that proves otherwise.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
You have to learn feeding times that work for Xena. Onset is typically 2-3 hours after the shot. Some cats (not all) dive down at onset. Steep dives can cause bounces. So for those cats, you ideally want to have fresh carbs (regular LC food) on board for then, so feed 1/2 hour before onset. With the limited data you have now, it looks like onset is after +2 and sometime before +3. If you get some +2.5 tests, and it's lower than preshot, you'll time the time down more accurately. For now, a +2 feeding would be a good start.

Once the depot fills, and her overall numbers come down so you are seeing some under 200 numbers, her nadir time will become clearer. Typical nadir is +6, so final feed should be before then, until you get more data that proves otherwise.
Click to expand...

makes sense. Lowered the amount of calories I’m feeding her today. I have some thinking to do. It’s all a bit of a crazy dance. I feel like… I understand that there are better times to feed her etc., but if I change the times, I’m feeding her it’s going to change the numbers, which can skew the picture of where the onset and Nadir is. Hurting my brain. … but I guess not feeding her after the point that we are assuming her nadir is, isn’t going to affect the conclusions were starting to come to. I hope that makes sense. Still running on no sleep.
Thank you again. I’m going to read your post again in a little while to make sure there’s nothing I missed … These responses from you experienced numbers are pearls. Don’t want to miss anything.
 
Onset should stay roughly the same. Nadirs might move a bit with food, but if feeding LC only, not appreciably.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Onset should stay roughly the same. Nadirs might move a bit with food, but if feeding LC only, not appreciably.
Click to expand...
Just started PM post and tagged you.
The one question I have is whether I should be feeding her with her shot and keep it at three meals a day or feed only at onset and nadir (approx)

this is what I am getting from what you’re saying.
I’m thinking I should probably change to TR, it seems to be more in line with how I’m doing things, but of course the TR instructions say to feed many small meals through the day. Not sure if that’s hard and fast rule.
 
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