4/1 Gus AMPS >600;New LANTUS DOSE ?

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bev5477

bev5477

Member Since 2011
After plotting Gus's curves for 3 days (3.5U) I see the characteristic checkmark spikes of rebound. Dramatic ups and downs, with no duration of lower BG. I then went back and plotted curves from when he was on 2U and saw a more rolling, gentler curve. Even with fewer tests earlier in the month, the difference is plain to see. I believe that we blew right by the correct dose. Now, how do I adjust his dose in order to bring him down gently?

Can I do a 'start over' with Lantus? I'm looking at using 1.5U Next dose due at 6PM EDT. Thanks
 
Re: 4/1 Gus AMPS >600 (3/31 PMPS 358)

I guess I'll reduce the dose by .5U this AM and feed him well. I expect a significant drop at +6, so I'll feed him about an hour before that to try to offset that drop. I'll test for ketones while reducing the dosage. Does the reduction need to be done slowly, as when you're increasing a dose? I read on another website that the dose should be reduced by 50% or taken down to 1U, whichever is the lower dose. I wasn't sure that this was OK and I sure didn't want to do it without some input from the dosing experts on this board.
 
Re: 4/1 Gus AMPS >600 (3/31 PMPS 358)

Good morning and welcome. :-D
It is generally fine to reduce the dose. Increasing should be done at smaller intervals as not to miss the correct dose.

It is also harder to comment what your dose should be as there is no spreadsheet to look at......do you have one?
 
Re: 4/1 Gus AMPS >600 (3/31 PMPS 358)

I'm planning on getting the spreadsheet up by this afternoon. Gus was at 4U but got 3.5U this AM.
 
Re: 4/1 Gus AMPS >600 (3/31 PMPS 358)

Good morning, Bev! Just wanted to say hello before heading btb (back to bed)! I do know folks in your shoes will sometimes just start over with a new dose rather than reduce slowly. I'm sure the experts will be along soon with suggestions on where to start! Until you get the SS up and running, posting Gus' recent #s will help them with suggestions. :)

So glad you've joined us! Have a great day! :)
 
Re: 4/1 Gus AMPS >600 (3/31 PMPS 358)

After reading around on the board, I see that I could have lowered Gus's dose by 20%. I'll do that next inj. time (+12) and hold it for 3 days. Hopefully the spikes disappear. I feel it in my bones that this the way to go. Now I'll see if the data supports my feeling. I'm glad that so many of you mentioned this reaction to a high insulin dose. I'm also glad that I did the curves of 2U from March 15-17. Classic rebound. Poor Gus. I owe him to get this right.
 
Re: 4/1 Gus AMPS >600 (3/31 PMPS 358)

Hi guys .. don't think I have commented on your condo's before .. so Hi! I know others will be here to answer your questions before to long ... I do know that some people start over at 1u and then increase from there, but wait for others to chime in first .. have a great weekend!
 
Re: 4/1 Gus AMPS >600 (3/31 PMPS 358)

Bev, I believe you can, though I'm sure one of our resident experts will be along at some point in the near future... we just tend to have slow traffic around midday.

I'd put Dose ? in your subject line to get attention.

What time do you shoot tonight, and what time zone are you in? You might put that in there as well so folks can give you an answer before your shot time.

I know how frustrating this all is. Trust me, most of us have been there! The important thing is, you're doing an amazing job helping Gus get back on track!!
 
Bev....

I know you want input on dose, and we would really like to be able to help you. Without data, we cannot give you that input. Several of us have asked you to please provide us with the data you have collected...either by setting up a SS and posting the link, or listing the data in a post.

Without specific test data, I would be guessing about what is going on, and I'm not comfortable doing that. Please provide us with your testing data so we can help you.
 
Good job getting the SS up...thanks! :smile: I'm wondering about the data prior to 3/15...at the lower doses...can you add that in? I see where you commented that the curves were more gentle...I'd like to see that data as well if you could provide it.
 
That data left my hands on 3/21 when we visited the vet. My glucometer only holds the last 28 values. The 'gentler' curves I referred to were from 3/15 and 3/16. Sorry about the rest. The lowest Gus got was 1.5U.
 
Afternoon and welcome!

This may be a stupid question, but have you tested the meter either on yourself or with the control solution? With all those highs I'm hoping maybe it's a bad meter or strips.

Good luck!

Jason
 
It's a glucometer manufactured by i-Pet. The test strip draws the blood up into the sample chamber and the BG is displayed after 10 seconds. The test measures glucose from 20mg/dl-600mg/dl (1.1 mmol/L-33.3mm/L). The meter is calibrated for feline glucose values and a control test is done on each new vial of strips. The memory function is great. If you, for some reason, forget to record the BG value, just hit the 'memory' button and there it is. It stores 28 results. There is also a function that gives the average of the last 28 results.
 
Bev, the test data looks very odd to me. I am wondering if your meter is inaccurate. Would you be able to get a human meter to get some comparison tests? I use the Relion Confirm, if you have a Walmart near you, that is a very good inexpensive meter (or the Micro, they use the same test strips). It's a good idea to have a back up meter anyway.

The pet meters are much more expensive to use, and the test strips are not readily available like the human meters. If your i-Pet meter turns out to be accurate, then it's fine to use it if you prefer, but most people here use human meters, and the test ranges are different. So, if you stay with the i-Pet, I would suggest that you put a note in your signature that indicates that you use that meter. It's important for people who are trying to help you evaluate your test results (particularly low numbers) to know that you are using a pet meter.....the number range is higher, so people may think Gus' numbers are fine, when in fact his numbers are too low. (human meter 50 = pet meter 80).
 
hey bev! looks like you're getting lots of input today. just fyi, it helps to change your subject line (by editing the first post's subject line) when you have an urgent question. Like in this case, you want an answer within a few minutes for your shot.

i'll bump up your post for ya!
 
If you want to lower his dose, that's up to you at this point. If you do reduce his dose, make sure you get ketone tests and watch his behavior.

I'm not sure that this data is accurate, so it's very hard to say whether he is over dose or not. I'm not trying to be difficult, but this data looks suspicious....it does not make sense.
 
Hi Bev and welcome to you and Gus.

I use a relion from Walmart also and love it. The strips are $20 for 50ct or $39 for 100ct.

Good luck and hope to see you posting everyday.

jan and sara
 
Bev --

I want to second Laurie's suggestion about using a human meter. If you look on Amazon for reviews on the iPet, it does not fare well when compared with the AlphaTrack which is a meter for use with animals. The iPet was found to be over 100 points higher than the AlphaTrack on multiple tests from the same vial of blood. Many people here use the Walmart Relion brand or like the Freestyle Lite. I use a Bayer Contour and I'm very happy with it.

I would hate to think that while Gus' numbers would still be high if your meter is off by 100+ points, it does suggest that as his numbers come down, you could be lulled by a false sense of security if his real numbers are a 32 and your meter reads 132.
 
Hi Bev and Gus,
Welcome to Lantus Land. Lots of great info. and advice to be had here. I second what others have recommended about getting a human meter like the Walmart ReliOn Micro or Confirm, or the FreeStyle Lite. If you are worried about your meter not being the same as your vet's, you can easily do a conversion when you show your vet the numbers, or simply tell the vet that you need to use the human meter because the test strips are much less expensive (test strips for the ReliOn meters are very inexpensive, and test strips for the FreeStyle can be bought inexpensively through AmericanDiabetesWholesale.com.).
I hope that you get Gus's dose straightened out soon and that the knowledgeable people here will be able to make recommendations based on data that are not questionable. When I found this board in Jan. 2010 with my kitty Stu, he was being overdosed on 7 units of Lantus bid. If I had not found this board, I think I would have lost him then. I took him down gradually in dose at first, but then bit the bullet and took him down to 1 unit, building up gradually to his best dose.
Best of luck to you. And good job in getting your spreadsheet up. That will be so important for getting the help that is so valuable here.

Ella & Rusty
 
Re: 4/1 Gus: New Meter

Lots of thank you's to those who took the time to explain about the meter. So many things to learn and un-learn. We'll be purchasing a new meter (probably a Reli-On) and strips tomorrow. I'll keep the old data on paper but will empty the spread sheet of any questionable data. This way, I'll have solid facts on which to base my decisions. Help is always appreciated. This disease really pushes you to become very knowlegable, very quickly. Looking forward to constructive input and advice.
 
Don't dump the data. Just skip a line and make a note about the meter change. Even if the numbers are "off", there may still be a pattern that will be worth keeping in mind.
 
I'll chime in about the Relion meters. I have the Confirm, and it's great. Needs a very tiny blood sample. I buy the 100 count box of strips for $39. Very economical, which is important if you get caught up in frequent testing, as I did :-D

Good Luck!
 
what most people do bev, when they have a significant change of some sort, is just put a dividing remark across the spread sheet to show that you've made a change. in other words, on whatever the next line number is you can change the color of each of the cells to indicate a major change.

to do that, look at the morning +5 column, go straight up and see the box divided in 4 quadrants with 4 colors? Don't do anything yet, you just want to know where it is. Now go down the left side column to the # line that's going to be your divider line between old info and new meter info. click on the line #, then go click on that 4 color box and pick a color to turn the whole line the color you've clicked on.

i don't know if there would ever be a reason you might need that info, but at least that way it's there if someone needs it. it does show when you started and what the vet directions were.
 
Bev, I'm so sorry about the meter, I have never seen data from an iPet meter so I wasn't aware of the problems with them...the data just looked inaccurate. There's no need to remove it....I would just leave it there and make a note when you start with the new meter, ok? It actually may be helpful to someone else down the road, you could help a newbie with it! It's a good example of the problem with this meter for others. We all benefit from collected information!

There is a steep learning curve, no doubt about it. You're doing fine though! :smile:

Oh, about the Relion strips.....I just went and got a few boxes of 100...they must have reduced the price, because they were only $36 each this time. :-D
 
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