355 and FUR SHOT - Now what?

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DiabeticMom

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I really hope the spreadsheet is really attached.

Chong was diagnosed 2/6 and seemed stable by 3/8 (low 200s at shot time, low 100 at low point) when I had to go out of town on business. I had a new cat sitter (well versed with cats) stay overnight & in and out the next 2 days. Chong was very angry (somewhat normal) and wouldn't let her test so we cut the dose to 1/2 normal insulin and gave .5 from Thursday night until Sat night when I got back and started back at 1 unit. I screwed up Sunday morning with daylight savings and think I gave insulin at 10 hrs, not 12. Chong has been all over the place since I got back hitting numbers in the mid and high 300s as well as going as low as 97, which was yesterday when I was on my way out. She acted very latheric and a little out of it so I tested her and saw the 97. I gave her dry DM and it picked her right up behaviour wise. I left the dry food out for her since I had to leave & wanted her safe against Hypo. She was 286 before her shot last night. I put the food away dry & wet) at 1 am and tested her at 5:30 am. She was at 331 and at 363 at 9:25 before I left for what I planned was the day. I gave 1 unit. Again afraid of Hypo (I'm ussually here) I left both dry & wet food out. She didn't eat much of it. Worried, I came back at lunch to check her. She was at 265 at 1:15. At 9:05 tonight she was 355. I was going to give her 1.25 but after her shot felt her fur wet. Not sure what, or if, she got insulin. Not sure what to do now. I gave her some FF and she ate about 1/2 of a small can. She was 15# in Jan and is about 13# now.

A sonagram in Feb showed pancreatitis but she regulated after that. She never seemed in pain before or since, or now.

She is laying down in a box near me in my office. Is this 'hiding'?

Help. What is happening? What should I do now. Afraid to give more insulin but . . . ? Should I test her in about an hour? At what number should I do something, and what should that be?

If you give suggestions to this post, please also tell me how long you have been dealing with feline diabetes. Just have to make sure info is legit. THANKS FOR YOUR HELP!

Barb
 
Hi - I'm Lu-Ann. My boy Grayson was diagnosed January 3rd, I changed from dry to Fancy Feast first, and started insulin on Jan 13th. Prozinc, 1 unit initially.

Grayson ran some really long cycles, and was sometimes not at a level I could safely shoot him.... so I waited, in some cases 24 hours. Long cycles were an indication of too much insulin so we dropped it. He then had Moderate ketones, and needed more insulin, so we quckly and gradually increased. I just did a further increase tonight.

We've had at least a few fur shots - you'll see the reds on my spreadsheet. You DO NOT shoot again. There's no way to know how much got in and how much didn't, and you'd risk hurting your cat if you shot again. If any registered, you'll know in the next few hours. If not, chalk it up to a fur shot, and shoot again at your next scheduled time.

If you're using the longer needles, you may have done an "in & out". I'm now using shorter ones, and I've shaved a little patch on Grayson's hip and shoulder where I typically inject. This has helped me tremendously He didn't seem to mind, and I feel like I'm getting more consistent numbers.

Probably the stress of a stranger, probably not doing testing in the same way you do it, your absence, as well as the change in dose, probably all came together to stress Chong out. Sometimes when things like that happen, you need to try a steady dose and try to get things back to "normal" ASAP. Sounds easy, but sometimes not so much. I've already sat down w/ one of my pet sitters, showed her how I do the testing (Grayson's "zen" position), and shooting. I stressed that he needs to be somewhat relaxed, even if he needs to be scruffed initially to "assume the position". My guys aren't accustomed to that, so they seem to pay attention!

Hope this helps... feel free to ask other questions.
 
Thank you.

Dumb question (another one): What is a cycle. I've looked everywhere and can't find an explanation for what a cycle or long cycle is. I've never heard this word used.

I have not checked for Ketones. I have marine stones to use. It is 11 pm now. Should I do this in the morning or set up the litter box now and set the alarm throughout the night until there is urine? How old is too old for urine to test?

How do I know if the needles are long or not. Is there a specified length on the box and how long should it be?

You 'quickly & gradually' increased insuline. Does that mean not more that .5 unit at a time?

Thank you. I don't find this website easy to use, and sometimes I don't have a couple of hours to investigate information, how to find it, or how to do something---like attach the signature. I didn't realize I am so computer illiterate.
 
Hi, I'm Sue, and I'm a relative newbie at this, Linus was diagnosed in January. I have learned so much from this website and message board, but you're right, when you're new and in a hurry to find information it can be hard.

Don't worry about the fur shot. Chong isn't going to suffer any long term effects from going overnight without insulin. High numbers are way safer than the extreme lows you could get from shooting twice. Just take a breath and start again in the morning. I don't know that I would even test overnight - you won't shoot anyway, and it will just stress you out. Get a good AMPS (am pre-shot) number and start from there.

Cycles are typically the 12 hours from shot to shot. Long needles are 1/2". These are what are on the u40 syringes you get from the vet for ProZinc. Some of us use u100 needles made for humans, these can come with either 3/8" needles (short) or 1/2" (long). The advantage to these is that you can increase or decrease the dose by much smaller increments. Most of us increase or decrease in .2 unit changes - you can't do that with the u40 syringes. The disadvantage is that you need to use a conversion chart - for instance, Linus' current 1.8u dose is 4.5 on the u100 syringe.

As you can see from our spreadsheet, numbers in the 300s are common, and just today things have started looking up. It takes a while to get regulated, or re-regulated in your case. But the short time with high numbers is not a problem as long as you are working toward lower ones.

Please stick around, and check the board tomorrow morning, there are lots of east coasters on here with way more experience. Relax and have a good night!
 
HI Barb:
I am Donna and my sugar cat is Asher. We were dx’ed with feline diabetes in January of 2011. I am by no means a dosing expert. Our cat doesn’t seem to go by the book most times, but we have learned a lot along the way. We always say here on the ProZync forum, every cat is different. Which is very true, but there are some similarities too. I am NOT a vet. But I can tell you what our experience has been and what has worked for us.

I took a quick look at your spreadsheet. My guess is Chong is bouncing (also called rebound) from going low into the green numbers. So the cats body tries to protect itself when the numbers go low into territory it’s not used to and dumps sugar to protect itself, thus those higher flat days. So my guess is you need to stay at your regular dose (the one that was working before when you had more regulated numbers) or maybe a nudge less, and stay there for awhile (a few days) and see if Chong levels out. Once they stop bouncing, you’ll know if you have to raise the dose again. If Chong repeatedly goes too low on you, or is too low to shoot at your preshoot test (below 200 usually), then you know you have to reduce the dose some. It sounds like you know how to bring up her low numbers with food, so that is good.

I find when our cat is in higher numbers he sleeps more and is less active. That may be the case with Chong. Hiding with our cats is way back under the couch near the wall, where you couldn’t find them unless you are really looking for them. Sitting in a box would be standard behavior, probably launching attacks out of the box too :lol: So you’ll have to judge since you know Chong best.

What works for our cat is holding a dose as long as we can stand it :shock: and keeping the food we feed very consistent in quantity and carb amount. We only feed twice a day before shots and a small snack or two durning the day and night. Other people here free feed (leave food out all day long and the cat eats as much as it wants) and sometimes people use a sliding scale for their dose, so like if the cat is 200, you shoot this amount, if the cat is 280, you shoot another amount.

There will be other folks to give you advise as the day goes on. Many folks here have dealt with pancreatitis so they will weigh in too. This forum is busiest morning and evening, and it seems right now many folks are east coast with a few scattered westward. That said, sometimes we check in mid day, or there are a couple people who have preshoot times mid day. So keep checking in here and we’ll try to be as helpful to you as possible.

Best,
 
Hi Barb,
I think one of the important things is to stop the dry food
the dry food will make his numbers go higher
Leaving wet food out should be suffient if he needs food'
I wouldnt raise the dose just yet especially if you stop the dry
as a wet food only will bring his numbers down
 
Good morning, Barb and Chong. ~O)

Poopy was Dx on 12/17/11, and what a ride it's been! :lol: If it were me, I'd keep the same lower dose for a bit, at least a few 12 hour cycles, to stop the bouncing, and not use the higher carbs. Regular low carb food is fine when dips are in the higher double digits.

The bouncing and higher carbs look to be causing the higher numbers you're getting from Chong. After the bouncing has stopped, you'll know whether or not to raise the dose a bit.

And fur shots...never re-shoot. We can't be sure how much insulin got in the kitty with a fur shot and re-shooting can end up with too much insulin in the kitty. Once the insulin is in, we can't get it back out. :sad: Better to be high a cycle than too low. :-D
 
Hi guys, I am Jenn & my big, brown cat is Baxter.
We have been doing FD for 4 months. At times it's a roller coaster mentally, emotionally & physically. it does get better with time. You will also learn how your cat responds to insulin. For me it was like building trust. I didnt have any trust in the beginning so I basically I didn't go anywhere & lost tons of sleep for about the first month. It has gotten a lot better. Sometimes I still struggle with being out & feeling the need to rush home to check on Baxter. I always test before I go somewhere.
I am not a dosing expert. I can not comment on how much to give. Im one of the cheerleaders of the group. I will root you on when you have good numbers. I will sometimes just sit back & let the experts give advice.

Like others have already explained. You do not want to increase while you are taking away the dry food. Once the dry food is gone & you have been dosing at certain amount & have data on how the body reacts then you would increase the dose. Maybe even decrease. Once you get the dry food out of the diet you will see some improvement in BG.

I hope you are feeling better & less stressed. Now you can take the 911 down from your post, but don't delete your post.

It gets better with time...Promise!

Jenn & Baxter cat_pet_icon
 
Hi Barb, welcome to our PZI corner of the world, I'm Robin and I joined in July of 2009, but lost my sweet boy this January to Kidney failure.

Your spreadsheet looks pretty good over all. I would stick with 1 unit for now as it seems to be working well.

Once you decide to switch over to low carb canned food only you may want to reduce your dose because the food switch can cause the bg's to fall rapidly.

A cycle is every 12 hour period after the injection.

Sorry if I've repeated something that was already answered.

There are no dumb questions. Keep coming back and asking.
 
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