3/4Ravan/amps372/+5 258/+9 188/pmps132/+3 102/+6 98/+9 69/

JoyBee&Ravan

JoyBee&Ravan

Member Since 2018
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/3-3ravan-amps339-3-372-8-250-pmps250-5-322-9-386.211435/
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Ravan's going all over the place! I see (possible) bounce March 2 nighttime and into the next day but it's happening in the middle of a lot of ups and downs so idk.
Maybe you gave a fur shot at some point?
Or it's just Ravan being a cat :rolleyes:
 
Judy and Boomer said:
you gave a fur shot at
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No fur shot. I give the shot in his flank. I see his white skin clearly & I'm very careful. I did a fur shot in the beginning when I was shooting into the scruff so I switched to his side.

I wish it was a fur shot these high #'s get me very upset! He starts leaking urine & I'm very concerned it's making his Kidney disease worse.:(
 
It looks like a bounce to me. Why is he bouncing higher than usual after a run in green ? Did you start using the calipers yet? If not, I think I would so you can take that out of the equation.

Talked to Mark's Pharm and they won't sell single Lev pens, but do Lantus, go figure. Darn!
 
He did a similar numbers rise end of January. The nadirs the last few days have been high enough you have room for a bit of an increase. Been seven cycles since he got as low as the 60’s. And eleven days on this dose.

Any change in food or supplements? I think I read somewhere you started Alnutrin?
 
Wendy&Neko said:
you started Alnutrin?
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Yes, they had a few dinners with Alnutrin mixed in on Saturday & Sunday. I only had a sample. Nothing else has changed. Today Ravan is acting normal . Even played a bit .
I don't understand if this is a bounce why does he come down to 200's yesterday & today then go back up into high 300's Looks like he's going to do the same today?
I didn't know a change in food could trigger a bounce? I thought it was from big drops in BG?
After 20 cycles without a Pink # I thought for sure he was finally used to the lower BG. That's why I didn't increase. I wanted him in high Green & blue for as long as possible.
Shouldn't I wait till after the bounce to increase the dose?

Bobbie And Bubba said:
Did you start using the calipers yet?
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The calipers I received are plastic,& don't have a screw to tighten. I borrowed my neighbors calipers that are metal. I'm using Monoject syringes. I opened both boxes,grabbed a dozen from each box & checked each one. They were all exactly 1.24 mm = 1 unit
I've been giving Ravan 1+ units = 1.87 with the calipers. I have to say it's tedious trying to get the exact # with the calipers. When I move the slide the tiniest bit it's jumping all over. It doesn't slide very easy? I have it locked on for 1.25 units tonight.
I'm surprised that all the syringes I checked were very accurate? I'll need to return the calipers, I told him I wanted to borrow them for a week.
 
Changing food won’t cause a bounce, but can cause higher numbers. As can inflammation, infection, constipation, pending hairbalks, ...

Bounces are caused by fast drops or lower numbers than they are used to. Occasionally from longer stretches in good numbers than they are used to. Do you think he is bouncing? On which cycle did the event occur? As I said above, it’s been over six cycles since the last lowish number, so any bounce from that should be gone. If you think the bounce causing event was another cycle, then just make sure you aren’t increasing on the cycle that bounce will break, no need to wait until the bounce is out of his system.
 
@Wendy&Neko

He doesn't have constipation & he never has hairballs. If he had an infection I don't think he'd be eating normal & playing with toys & his sister.
I'm confused at these high #'s He had 20 cycles of good bg That's why I did not expect a bounce. He's been having more good BG than bad. I felt he was getting used to being in good #'s.
The "bounce " started on the 21st cycle.That's why I'm asking for a more experienced opinion. Is this a bounce or did his bg go up suddenly to these high #'s ? I just don't know which it is.
Should I wait longer to see if he goes back down? It's going on 4 cycles that his bg is high.

I just checked his bg He's down to 188. It looks like it might have been a bounce. I'll probably wait till tomorrow AM to increase his dose if he doesn't come down to green.

This still leaves me confused as to why the big bounce afer being in good #'s so long?
 
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When did you start using the calipers? Is it related to when his BG changed?

When you go from not using calipers to using them, there’s usually a need to adjust the dose. Bounces can happen off blue numbers. If he’s potentially getting a little less insulin because of the change to calipers, it could be it’s not enough insulin which could cause him to bounce off numbers he wasn’t bouncing off before.

We might not know for certain but it is clear he needs more insulin unless he clears the bounce tonight and comes into green. If he doesn’t, I’d increase to 1.25u in the morning.
 
Marje and Gracie said:
When did you start using the calipers? Is it related to when his BG changed?
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Started using them on March 1st. It doesn't appear that it's what caused the bounce.
When I checked a bunch of the Monoject syringes with the calipers all the ones I checked were accurate, the lines all matched. The calipers I'm using are borrowed I'll need to return them.
 
JoyBee&Ravan said:
Started using them on March 1st. It doesn't appear that it's what caused the bounce.
When I checked a bunch of the Monoject syringes with the calipers all the ones I checked were accurate, the lines all matched. The calipers I'm using are borrowed I'll need to return them.
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The thing about the MJs is the insulin gets in the hub and you have no idea from shot to shot how much is in the hub. That’s why I quit using them and so did Ella as well as other people. When I contacted the company about it, they couldn’t care less and I actually told them I was using the syringes to give shots to a child as I knew they would be really dismissive if it was for a cat.

So if you are using MJs, that might possibly be the issue....inconsistent dosing based in the hub. When I ran tests of syringes, due to that hub, they were the ones that were most consistently off by 0.25-0.5u.
 
JoyBee&Ravan said:
I wish I had heard about that a month ago. I have over 200 Monoject syringes so I'll just need to use these up before i buy a different brand! Is there a brand that is more accurate?
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I don’t know because I used Terumos which are no longer made. You’d have to ask around on the forum.

You might want to read this condo post: Post 86

Having said that, Ella went back to MJs after Terumos were discontinued because the lines were better and it was easier to draw without bubbles. So, I’d say if you like them, you’ll just have to understand there is likely some variance in the dose if the needle sticks down from the cone into above the zero line on the syringe. (Had to fix that as I worded it wrong).
 
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I just now looked at the drawing of the syringe. I see what you mean by the needle sticking into the cone shape! That's terrible that they haven't corrected it!I thought the cone shape was solid.
Even people using them are getting more insulin than they realize. That's not right! I'm surprised they can get away with such a flawed design? I'm going to check if I can return them in exchange for
a different brand. Makes me mad!

Thanks for alerting me. I'll ask around to see if any other brand is better.( I don't know how to judge now how much insulin is actually in that cone?)
 
JoyBee&Ravan said:
I looked at a lot of them & do not see the needle sticking down into the syringe. Do you think maybe they improved them?
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They didn’t do it intentionally if it has improved. You have to remember that they make these for humans, not pets, unlike the Terumos. The difference in insulin in that cone and how it varies is insignificant to a human. Same for how inaccurate syringes are. But it makes a big deal for pets on tiny doses.

I am certain you will not be able to send them back. However, as I said, after the Terumos were discontinued, Ella went back to the MJs. You might want to PM her and ask if the issue was corrected but I believe she was still having problems. As I recall, Rusty was in a tiny dose and the amount of insulin going into the cone was more than his dose!

I used very accurate micropipettes to measure the volume in the syringes. When I found a least a dozen of MJ syringes where the zero line was perfect, the doses were still off by 0.25u - 0.5u due to the cone. BUT, this was many, many years ago and it could have been that they just had a ton of lots where the needles were inserted just into the cone causing extra insulin to be drawn. Use your magnifying glass, check a bunch of syringes, and see if the needle comes down just into the cone and not all the way to the zero line in the syringe.
 
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