3/19 Purrdy AMPS160 +3 103 +5 112 - Vyktor: flaucitis :(

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purrdydolly

purrdydolly

Member Since 2014
Yesterday

Recap
AMPS 119
+3 113
+5 112
+8 132
PMPS 148
+3 117
+5 115

Happy to see that almost green +3 from Purrdy, I was already starting to think failed reduction but it looks like he might be getting back to business.

Sorry I didn't get back yesterday I was absorbing Vyktor's not so great news and doing a bit of research. The flaucitis (inflammation in the mouth of the area where the top and bottom jaws join) is the same problem he had 'fixed' with his dental last October. One side wasn't too bad but the other side was very overgrown and infected and he has ulcers in his mouth and a huge one down the side of his tongue - amazing he was eating at all. The vet has cut the tissue away again and sent off to a histologist (or something like that) to see if we can pinpoint the cause. I understand that the chances are it's being caused by a dodgy immune response but it's not related to bacteria on teeth as he has none left in the problem areas (he only has 3 teeth) so can't be resolved with further removals. Because it has reoccurred the chances are it will continue to reoccur.

The usual options to treat as the vet sees it are intermittent ABs (huge issues pilling Vyktor - he got convenia again this time - I'm going to ask about using something stronger and injectable - maybe Baytril not sure if we have it injectable) with steroids (which the vet has said he won't give to Vyktor because of his diabetes) or the diabolical Metacam. So pretty depressing news. I said I wanted to look at natural options and he has supplied me with the contacts for a naturopath vet at one of the vet hospitals and a homeopathy vet. We will await the histo results to get a better idea of what we're looking at but slippery elm as an anti-inflam comes to mind immediately so I might go ahead and order some of that.

He didn't come out of the anaesthetic so well this time. Apparently his vitals were all fine throughout but he took a lot longer than usual to wake up. I guess he's doing okay now all things considered as some food is going in when I hold the bowl for him but he'll cry or groan while he's eating and then bat his face and hide in the cupboard (he hasn't gone in the cupboard since his diabetes was treated) after he's done. He is having bupe so I hate to think how much worse it would be without that. I slept on the floor with him last night and he got up 4 times I know of (between 1 and 5 am) so I was hopeful he was eating but he must have just had a sniff and/or a tiny bite each time because only about 20g of food was gone. The last time, at 5am he also started pacing which I understand can be another sign of pain :(

If anyone has any experiences or suggestions to share they would be most welcome. I guess I'll post in health too.

He's had the gorgeous front shave too because he had some matts, I guess I will appreciate it more later when the shock has worn off and, hopefully, I have a plan of action. Sorry I can't share, when I try to upload from my laptop the upload button takes me to some place in the laptop that I don't recognise and I don't seem to be able to go anywhere else from there.
 
Good boy Purrdy! (But seriously, you can lose the blues now- K?? Tiger :cat:

(((((((Serryn & Vyktor))))))) Oh $&!!%%%, this is not what we wanted for Vyktor! Nothing worse than getting blindsided :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug: Gentle hugs for Vyktor :bighug:

Surely there has to be some of those meds that can be given as compounds, injectibles or transdermals? I know at least Clavamox can be(but it cost 20 times more than pills :rolleyes: but I am sure cost is the last thing on your mind right now!!) I am not versed on dental at all, so going to google(Dr.Google yet again :rolleyes:) Sending truckloads of healing vines and prayers and hugs!!
 
Baytril can be given subcutaneously if your vet will give it to you that way.
 
oh boy - what a yucky thing for vyktor to have to deal with. Just an fyi - metacam isn't an antibiotic. It's an pain killer - might have anti-inflammatory properties, i'm not certain.

I'm glad you don't have to worry about getting food into him and shooting him during this time. I imagine his mouth just plain hurts and he will eat more as it heals.

The thing to watch on Baytril is the size of the dose. Just double check with Dr. Google - an overdose on Baytril can cause blindness. I only had it in liquid for punkin and apparently it was the most vile thing he'd ever tasted - he walked throughout the house foaming at the mouth and vomiting. It was compounded as a flavored liquid, but people here told me the actual baytril is bitter, so i don't know if it you can make it palatable. Perhaps it's available as an injectible, as you said.
 
If this is an immune response, what about something like L-lysine to boost his immune system? (unless you mean that Vyktor's immune system is on overdrive).
 
Yes it would be steroids or metacam to act as an anti-inflammatory along with an AB for infection. I don't think we have compounding pharmacies here I have never heard of anyone using one and I'm pretty sure I've hunted before but I will look into it again - I was just sooking to mum about that aspect - you guys are a bit more spoiled for options. Fortunately cost is not an issue.

@Sienne and Gabby yes it is the immune reaction in that area on overdrive, except that about 30% of cases are in immune system compromised cats - with FIV or leukaemia??? I will have a look at Llysine thank you
 
Purrdy - time to work it, sisterbean has a lot on her mind right now.

Serryn - so sorry you are dealing with this. :bighug: How is Vyktor with liquid meds? Neko got clindamycin after her dental, as a liquid called Antirobe Aquadrops (no sugar, no taste). Clindamycin is often used for dental infections.

Jill posted a new thread in the Health Forum on the AAHAAAFP 2105 Pain Management for Dogs and Cats.

I'm trying a couple of alternative solutions for Neko's arthritis that might help Vyktor. Acupuncture can help with pain. I'm also giving Neko Duralactin/Microlactin which is supposed to help inflammation, such as stomatitis which I think is related to faucitis.
 
Sending healing vines and fast recovery vines to Vyktor. Poor kitty. I hope he feels much better soon.
 
(((Serryn))) I am so sorry about the diagnosis but folks here will help you will figure out the options and then you can decide what to do. Big hugs.
Liz
 
Hi Serryn,
I'm so sorry to hear about Vyktor and hope that you can find the right combination of meds to help his problem. I'm taking the liberty of tagging @Linda and Bear Man to see if she has any insights for you. She has a lot of knowledge, although this problem may be out of her experience.

Sending lots of vines for pain-free eating.

Glad Purrdy is doing well,

Hugs and scritches,
 
I'm so sorry to hear about Vyktor's mouth - adding my hopes to the others' that you can track down something that will help his mouth and bring him out of the cupboard
 
Wendy - I do have better luck with liquid Meds if they don't taste vile so I will ask about clindamaycin and also the other anti-inflams you mentioned. Hopefully they are available here - anything has to be better than steroids or metacam. I do think stomatitis is related as far as inflammatory symptoms go but I think the causes can be a bit of a mystery so how closely related I don't know.

He's not eating now so with the vets approval I've given his Bupe a couple of hours early.
 
I'm so sorry to hear about Vyktor's Dx. Faucitis seem to be closely related to stomatitis, which we have been struggling w/ for Emma for 2 years. She recently had 9 teeth extracted and we are hoping that this takes care of it. The vet was amazed at the degree of the stomatitis, but Emma never had any problem eating or showed signs of pain. What I understand is that stomatitis is an out of whack auto-immune response to plaque. Her teeth were clean, didn't need cleaning, but just the presence of plaque in the mouth can set off the reaction.

Here's what we have tried:
  • Prednisolone ( steroid) - did clear things up but the sores returned. Every subsequent treatment was less effective.
  • Unique protein diet - didn't notice any difference, however she does og out and i think helps her self to the neighbor cat's food, as well as lizards and gophers.
  • 1-TDC - didn't see any difference, but things did seem to get worse after we stopped it, or maybe they were getting worse anyway. It's an essential fatty acid formula that is supposed to help
  • Slippery Elm Bark - supposedly coats the sores to plevent exposure to plaque. No effect.
  • Transfer Factor - didn't notice much difference, but things did seem to get worse after we stopped it, or maybe they were getting worse anyway. Basically it is Colostrum.
  • Colostrum - We are trying a different form now, too soon to tell.
  • Thymic extract - Just started trying it http://www.ivcjournal.com/case-reports/792/ Our vet is looking into the product listed, but we are trying a generic for now.
  • MaxiGuard Oral Cleansing Gel - may help, may not
  • Brushing teeth - couldn't brush near the sores, bleeding
  • Rx for Pets Liquid Immuno - not sure if it helped or not, had a hard time getting and have been using a different product w/ Reishi mushroom, but I may try it again since I found a new source. http://www.pawzooka.com/rx-vitamin-liquid-immuno-for-pets/
Our vet actually had us stop giving l-Lysine. Emma was getting it for for possible feline herpes, but Dr. S had read an article that it could aggravate auto-immune problems.

We are waiting to see how her mouth heals after the extractions, after 2 weeks we resume the MaxiGuard and after 3 start brushing again. Our vet is looking into the specific brand and protocol used for the thymic extract, as well as stem cell therapy tried at UC/Davis. http://www.vetmed.ucdavis.edu/whatsnew/article.cfm?id=2789

Here's a good article I found on Faucitis and Stomatitis http://maxshouse.com/Stomatitis and Faucitis.htm
 
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Oohhh, poor Vyktor!!! I wish I could just hold and hug him! I'm so sorry he's in pain, and I know it hurts you, too, not being able to help. Sending tons of healing and pain relief vines and lots of :bighug::bighug::bighug:

Purrdy, you be a good boy now and surf some pretty numbers so sisterbean can concentrate on Vyktor. He sure looked good with that low blue surf yesterday.
 
I'm so sorry that Vyktor is in pain. My vet does not use metacam for cats anymore, because it's been banned for use in cats, but he thinks banning it was a mistake. He says that there are cases were the benefits outweigh the risks. I know ginger is anti-inflammatory in humans. It might be worth looking into for cats, although I have no idea how you'd get it into him! Sending big hugs.

Vyktor, I come hold your paw. When you feels better, I cook da turkey no matter what you mommy said. Dat help for sure.
 
Oh, so sorry about Vyktor, Serryn sending you and him lots of healing energy and gentle hugs. Hope his pain is diminished soon. :bighug:
 
I'm so sorry about Vyktor's diagnosis....I wish I had answers for you. I also suffer from mouth sores, so I know how brutal the pain is...poor Vyktor.

If you go with liquid ABs...is there a compounding pharmacy that can flavor them to something appealing for Vyktor? When I had Trix's banana meds made, I actually did have the option of various meat flavors (I know...), but I went with banana because it was a short course of ABs and I didn't want to possibly create an aversion to her regular food. But if Vyktor is going to be on them on-and-off indefinitely, maybe using a more feline-tempting flavor would be better for him.

Sending tons of healing prayers..
 
Healing prayers for Vyktor and a hug for you too Serryn. There is a compounding pharmacy in Sydney and our vet uses it for her cat and her patients too. I will ask her and tell you the name of the pharmacy if you want and in regards to metacam a Melbourne vet Dr Richard Gowan has done studies on it in cats who have kidney disease and arthritis and he believes in its use and has stated that whilst cats should be monitored while on metacam that he has found it to be a very useful medication in certain cats. You can email his clinic or call for more information on his studies or do a Google search on his studies. He and many Australian vets according to our vet don't have the big fear of metacam that American vets do. According to our vet Australian vets do not follow the drug manufacturer's guidelines on dosage. She said that Australian vets claim that the manufacturer has set the recommended dose of metacam at the dose that pays more attention to profit margins than the wellbeing of cats. She said that Australian vets use a lower dose which is still effective for cats. It is all very interesting but Dr Richard Gowan is well respected and passionate about pain relief in cats and whilst I know the controversy and warnings about metacam in cats vets here are less anxious about its use. Everyone I know who has been to his cat clinic has spoken highly of him and the other vets there too. I have been anxious about our vet's recommendation of metacam for my Lucy for her arthritis but we may have to use it if alternatives don't work. I am trying everything possible to avoid it if we can and hopefully we can avoid using it because reading about metacam on the internet makes me anxious. I hope Vyktor is better very soon.
 
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