3/10 Sheba low at +12 (109)

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Bron and Sheba (GA)

Bron and Sheba (GA)

Member Since 2015
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/3-9-sheba-amps-316-4-212-7-104-pmps-365.134299/

It is 11.30 pm here in Sydney. We have cousins staying with us from the country at the moment and Sheba chose tonight to stay low at PMPS. I tested her at +11 (108) as she was still dropping at +10 (122) so I was prepared, I thought, for a low number. At +12 she was 109 but I was too scared to shoot that low. I have not shot lower than about 150. Also I found it hard to think while trying to make conversation to our visitors (who I love to see and catch up on news). To make things worse, Sheba was going in and out of the LB trying to wee several times without success. My DH was doing a great job keeping the conversation going and looking after things generally because I couldn't think straight and I am sure my cousins thought I was bonkers!:confused:

In the end I stalled until +13.40 when she was 176. By this time she had stopped trying to go to the LB, so I felt a bit more comfortable to shoot. I would have liked to have taken the opportunity to shoot lower but I could not get onto the computer to send a message to you and the 109 is much lower than I felt comfortable with on my own, especially with the LB issue happening at the same time. I am not giving her any added fluids tonight with her meal as I am not sure why she was squatting without success. She has done it twice before over the last year and it resolved on its own in an hour or two. Hope it does tonight.
Update: I just took her to the LB and she obliged by doing a wee, no problem, which I caught and tested with the multistix and it was all fine.........

I have just tested her +2 and she is 248 so a bit of a food spike but not as much as she often spikes. Looks like she might be having another active cycle. This morning she started at 466 (terrible) but instead of getting on a rocket, she boarded a hot air balloon and drifted to the lagoon. :cat: I didn't have to give any carbs to manage the drop. A nice stress free morning but she sure made up for it tonight.

Was that a bounce she had last night and this morning?

I am still having trouble trying to put in the extra numbers in the SS eg +11.50 and the BSL. I put them in the US sheet but they are not right. I thought I was following directions correctly but.....

Any advise, help would be welcome.
Thanks.
Bron
 
You need to put a space after the number and after the @ so the info will go down the cell instead of across it, at the moment the spreadsheet thinks it's all one word so it reads across. Then you can add the colour by clicking on the icon at the top of the page that looks like a paint tin being poured and select the appropriate colour from the box that appears.

Yes that was a bounce and she cleared it pretty fast so that is great :joyful:
 
Thanks Serryn. I will try the SS again.
I see you also had a low PS. I'll be happy when I feel comfortable shooting low.
Thanks for looking in on me
Bron
 
once you've had a lower preshot, you almost always will find yourself facing another one before long. Fortunately for you, I have a stash of resources I give people, cuz I'm all over the shooting low thing. :) I can totally understand not doing it when things are bonkers at your house, though. You want to shoot low for the first time when things are normal and you can be able to monitor afterwards.

Here's the "Where Can I Find?" post. For information on shooting low (meaning to shoot the full dose into normal numbers - 50-120 on a human glucometer) look at

1. the "Shooting & Handling Low Numbers" sticky on the top half of the post
2. Shooting Low post in the bottom half of the post among the "interesting posts" section - make sure you scan down to the conversation on shooting low and also look at the spreadsheet examples that are linked.
3. TR Protocol: Myths Debunked post also in the bottom half of the post among the interesting posts section. On this one, there are multiple topics - scan down til you find the one on "shooting a dropping number."

You could also look at several current posters' spreadsheets. Sammy's come out of remission and his spreadsheet is good to look at.
Elise's Max in 2014 and Max in 2015
Rooh is another one.

What you are looking for is the transition that happens in the spreadsheet when the person begins shooting green numbers.
 
Hi Julie,
Thank you for all the above resources. I haven't had a chance to read them yet, but I will as soon as I can get to them. I really want to learn to shoot low, but last night was not the time to do it, as you said, and I did not feel I was in control of the situation at all. It was hard trying to think straight and to appear to be carrying on an adult conversation:cool:. And with Sheba suddenly squatting numerous times in the LB, I just got more stressed and felt like going into a corner and crying. That problem has gone thankfully and she is back to normal with her wees. Not sure why she was doing it. She had just done a loosish poop before she started squatting, so maybe she had an urge. But she was squatting in the wee position not the poop......

I am now almost one and a half hours behind my normal shooting schedule but with daylight saving finishing on April 5 I might stay here and it will be easier to swap back to ordinary time. Am I thinking in the right direction with that?

If I get into that situation again, can I post and ask for help or support please?
Thanks so much for being there.
Bron
 
tiffmaxee said:
If she continues to go in and out of the lb she might have a UTI so a urinalysis and culture might be needed. I hope not.
Click to expand...
Thanks tiffmaxee. It looks like she is back to normal again but if she starts doing it again, I will take her to the vet. Thanks for looking in on me
Bron
 
Please post and ask for support whenever you feel that you need it. I will be home tonight and will check in on you.
 
Definitely post and ask for help the next time you see such a similar situation. One thing to think about, Sheba is on Levemir, and some Lev kitties will often have their nadir as late as +12, so we have to get used to shooting lower. When you go that +12.75 and it was on the way up, that could have been a time to shoot. Just FYI - I shot Neko today at 108, cause I had a +9 before than of 115, and that small change told me she was either surfing, or nadired in between and was on her way up. Since her onset is about 5 hours later, I have plenty of time to feed her and get her numbers up. I totally get with the guests and Sheba being off why you hesitated last night, just putting something out there for you to consider next time.

The example spreadsheets Julie gave you were Lantus kitties. Kitties on Levemir around here beside Neko are Gracie, Rusty, Tess, Milo, Toby and Crystal. I love it when Neko gives me an 80's for preshot at night, cause it usually means she'll surf there all night.

It's up to you if you want to switch the schedule now or wait 3 weeks. You can move the time 15 minutes a cycle, or 30 minutes once a day, if you want to get back on track before then.
 
Wendy,
I don't get what you mean when you said that you tested at +9 and got 115 and you shot at 108 because the small change told you she was surfing or nadiring inbetween and on her way up. It looks to me as if she was going down at PS. Can you explain it to me please. You obviously know a lot more about SS numbers than I do!!!!
I would love to be able to look at the low numbers, understand where they are going, and feel confident to shoot and not be a nervous wreck.
Thanks
Bron
 
Bron and Sheba said:
Wendy,
I don't get what you mean when you said that you tested at +9 and got 115 and you shot at 108 because the small change told you she was surfing or nadiring inbetween and on her way up. It looks to me as if she was going down at PS. Can you explain it to me please. You obviously know a lot more about SS numbers than I do!!!!
I would love to be able to look at the low numbers, understand where they are going, and feel confident to shoot and not be a nervous wreck.
Thanks
Bron
Click to expand...
Not Wendy but what she meant was when she tested at +9 the BG was 115. Her pmps BG was 108 and that is when she gave the shot.
 
Not Wendy either, but what I think her point was that since the +9 of 115 and the PMPS of 108 were so close together, she knew she was either surfing right there in the same general area or had possibly dropped lower than the 115 sometime in those 3 hours and at PMPS was actually coming up
 
Bron and Sheba said:
don't get what you mean when you said that you tested at +9 and got 115 and you shot at 108 because the small change told you she was surfing or nadiring inbetween and on her way up. It looks to me as if she was going down at PS. Can you explain it to me please.
Click to expand...
I have lots of data on Neko. There are 3 hours between +9 and +12, so she was either surfing because given meter variance there is no difference between 115 and 108, or she'd gone down a tiny bit in the intervening hours and was on her way back up. That last bit I know because she's been on Levemir for a year and a half and I've tested what she does in that part of her cycle a lot.

When people are stalling at preshot because of a lowish number, we tell them that if they see that kitty is surfing about the same number or on their way up, they are OK to shoot.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
I have lots of data on Neko. There are 3 hours between +9 and +12, so she was either surfing because given meter variance there is no difference between 115 and 108, or she'd gone down a tiny bit in the intervening hours and was on her way back up. That last bit I know because she's been on Levemir for a year and a half and I've tested what she does in that part of her cycle a lot.

When people are stalling at preshot because of a lowish number, we tell them that if they see that kitty is surfing about the same number or on their way up, they are OK to shoot.
Click to expand...

Thanks Wendy. I can see I have to learn to shoot when the numbers are about the same even if they are low. What about if they are dropping say from 6 to 5 for example. Is that a drop or about the same?
 
Meter manufacturers are allowed to be within about 20%. At lower numbers, I call it the same if it's within 10%, but that's just me building in a safety margin. I'd call 6 to 5.5 about the same. I also look at how far and how fast is Neko dropping into preshot. Although what a kitty dropped the previous hour isn't going to be the same the next hour, it does tell me whether it's the part of the cycle near nadir where she's slowing down.

The other thing about shooting lower numbers is gaining experience and confidence to do so, based on what Sheba has done before in similar situations. Next time you get a chance to shoot low, and are able to monitor without distractions, use it as an opportunity to gather data. As you build confidence, you'll lower that number where you you feel you need to delay. I shoot Neko with dropping numbers all the time - I even had to do it on Lantus as she has always had a late nadir. Now that she's on Levemir, it's easier, because onset is so much later and I know she's rise until then. Neko often has a cycle that looks like a upside down curve, with the low points at preshot, whereas Lantus kitties usually curve down, with the high points at preshot. But as in all things, ECID and not all Levemir kitties nadir as late as Neko. it's more common that they nadir around +8 and are on the rise by preshot.
 
Thanks Wendy. Great info.
Sheba seems to have an onset about +3 a lot of the time, sometimes later. Sometimes she just keeps going down. Is that coming off a bounce? I will try and shoot a lower number than I have before (150) and gradually go down as I feel more confident. I remember when I was nervous at 180..
I was looking through my diary of 2011 when Sheba was on insulin first time. I didn't keep good records at all and knew nothing about FDMB. This particular day I was doing a curve and she was only on a tiny amount of insulin..less than 0.25. My curve was 4.4; 3.2; 3.3; 4.2 I did not give any food or write down that I was at all concerned with the numbers. Ignorance is bliss! She came off the insulin the next week.

I know you have an ongoing issue with smudges and jenni at the moment, so leave me - Just help them. I hope it goes OK for her. Poor thing. It is awful when kitties are sick.
Bron
 
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