3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72, +3 56, +4 70

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worldtraveller

Member Since 2011
I came back from a week's holiday and have this week I converted Kitty to wet food! Since Thursday he's been only getting canned food (Gourmet Gold, same as Fancy Feast I think), and now his BG is just blues and greens. Yahoo!

Last night BG was 92 and I decided not to give a shot. At +2 he was 117.

This morning I overslept (oops!!) so I was late testing his morning BG. At +2 from his normal morning shot his BG was 97, so I decided not to give a shot again! At +7 (from the normal AM shot) it was still 110. You can see his BGs in the SS.

It may have been stupid to skip the 2 shots, but I just did not feel comfortable to shoot with these relatively low BGs especially when he has just started the wet-food-only diet.

His evening shooting time will be in about 3 hours, so any advise what to shoot then?
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty in blues and greens. Dosing advise?

worldtraveller said:
His evening shooting time will be in about 3 hours, so any advise what to shoot then?
Actually, when you skip a shot, you can then change the next shot time, if you need it to be earlier. Don't forget daylight savings time starts tomorrow ;-) .

Be right back. I'm going to take a look at your ss.
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty in blues and greens. Dosing advise?

Very interesting. Two skipped shots in a row and low blue numbers. I'm going to ask for some more opinions on this.
Can you get another test in an hour and post that number, please? I think that would actually be your +34 number.

Looks like that switch to canned, did a lot of good, huh :cool:
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty in blues and greens. Dosing advise?

Thanks Dyana!
Kitty's BG was now 157, and that would make it +32 since the last shot, wow! :). In the last hour he just had quite a bit tuna, his favourite food.

We are in Moscow (Russia), so evening shot coming up soon... I would think I need to give a shot, just not sure what would be the right dose. When I was travelling for a week, my kitty sitter gave 1.5U BID and Kitty was still on dry food then. When I came back, I gave 2U when he still had some dry food, but since being off dry I lowered it to 1.5U - though now we have skipped two shots because of lowish BGs.
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty in blues and greens. Dosing advise?

If you're not comfortable yet with shooting lower numbers, one option is to lower the dose so you can shoot consistently. You could drop the dose to 1.25u (or even 1.0u). This would be like starting over. You may see higher numbers for a while but for many people, it's easier on the nerves to deal with higher numbers and increase the dose than to have to cope with lower numbers and reduce.
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty in blues and greens. Dosing advise?

mia! welcome home - and what a nice thing to come home too!

we want you to have a dose that you can give the same dosage every 12 hrs. definitely want a reduction, we're talking about what a good new dose would be.
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty in blues and greens. Dosing advise?

Thanks for advise!!

Another hour later Kitty was 212 (+33).
Evening shot coming in about 2 hours... I'm thinking 1U or 1.25U, but I don't have any science behind this, just a gut feeling :)

Another point here is that from coming Monday afternoon to Friday evening I will be travelling again so kitty sitter will be giving dose for the coming week (she's not testing). Tomorrow I will be home all day and will be doing a curve, but I guess that may not necessarily be a good curve since the 2 shots were missed... We'll see... :-|
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty in blues and greens. Dosing advise?

lantus is a cumulative insulin - so after several missed shots the cumulative effect is gone. even so, i would do the tests tomorrow every 3 hours anyway, though, just because when you start on lantus that's what you do to make sure the dose isn't too much. at least it would tell us some information.

since you've got a petsitter coming again, i think i'd go with the 1unit. without them testing you would need to drop the dose again anyway.
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72

Kitty's PMPS was 202, and I gave him 1U. Now at +2 BG was down to 72.

Will be interesting to see how the curve develops tomorrow....

Thanks all for your help!!!
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72

mia - that's a huge drop. that signals a need for you to keep an eye on him.

would you check again at +2.5 or +3 and repost? we may need to help you manage his numbers tonight.
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72

Thanks Julie for looking after us! Yes, I'll test at +3.
He did not eat much at the evening shot time, but has now eaten canned food after +2 reading....
will keep you posted on his +3....
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72

good - thanks!

in a cat with a "good" dose of insulin, the +2 will be about the same as the preshot number. that's assuming they've eaten with their shot, you've likely had a little bit of a food spike in BG numbers, and then it's come down back to the preshot number.

when you see a significant drop by +2 that means that kitty's likely to drop farther before the nadir and rising again.

just so you're prepared, it's not a crisis if he drops below 50, but you will want to open a can of high carb food, squish out about a teaspoon of the gravy for him to eat. then post here and ask for help. someone will walk you through what to do next. it's basically a lather, rinse and repeat process. but it's less nerve wracking if someone helps you through the first time.

anytime you don't have high carb food, you can add a drop of karo syrup to a little bit of regular cat food and it's the same action.

i'll watch for your response, but of course, anyone else can help you too.
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72, +3 56

Kitty is now down to 56 at +3. This was still in the middle of him eating... With dry food, his nadir was usually at +3/+4, but of course this may be now a new situation with the new diet.

I guess I would need to stay up a bit longer to monitor him. Should I give him HC food in any case if he goes below 50?
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72, +3 56

nope, don't give him any yet. please retest in 20 minutes and post again. if he was just eating low carb food that's fine. if he wants another teaspoon of lc that would be great.
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72, +3 56

I want to give you this info from the sticky above on "handling low numbers" just so you can be familiar with the process.

this is actually awesome that it's happening now, because we can get him to a better dose before the petsitter comes into the picture and there's no testing.

DON'T PANIC! or HOW TO HANDLE LOW NUMBERS

First, try to not panic. Post to the Lantus Insulin Support Group or on the Health Board. Make sure your subject line indicates you are concerned about a possible hypo and/or add the 911 icon to the first post in your condo. People who are experienced in dealing with low numbers will be there to help. After posting, remember to refresh your browser periodically to see if people have replied.

It’s important to recognize that just because your cat may be experiencing low BG numbers doesn’t mean that your kitty is critically hypoglycemic. Many cats will have low numbers and never have symptoms. It’s important, though, to bring those numbers up into a safe range. ALWAYS make sure you have a stock of test strips, high carb (HC) canned food that contains gravy and is over 15% carb such as Fancy Feast grilled, marinated, or Gravy Lovers varieties (see Janet & Binky's Food Chart for a full list of options), and/or a simple sugar solution such as Karo/corn syrup, honey, maple syrup, etc.

If your cat is experiencing symptoms, especially if those symptoms are severe, you need to rub Karo syrup, honey, or maple syrup on the gums or, if symptoms are very severe, administer rectally and get your cat to the nearest 24-hour emergency facility. Take the bottle of syrup with you to administer on the way if necessary. (Note that it is rare that we see episodes of symptomatic hypoglycemia with Lantus and even rarer to see severe symptoms. But, you need to know what to do should they occur.)

The symptoms to be concerned about include but are not limited to:
staggering, uncoordinated movements, 'drunken' walk, wobbling, balance problems
ataxia - usually lack of muscular coordination, but maybe changes in head and neck movements
disorientation (yowling, walking in circles, etc.)
twitching
stupor
convulsions or seizures
coma
If your cat is testing in low numbers and you are not getting a quick response to your post, there are several things you need to do. (Low numbers are under 50mg/dL or 2.8 mmol/L.)

Depending on how carbohydrate sensitive your cat is, feed approximately a teaspoon or less of food with high carb (HC) gravy or HC food only. (If you have a cat with GI issues, using syrup plus LC food is an alternative.)
Test again in 15 – 20 min. Depending on the numbers, give more HC food.
Repeat the above steps every 15 – 20 min. until your cat tests in the 50 mg/dL (2.8 mmol/L) or above range for 2 consecutive tests. Continue to feed in small amounts to keep numbers in a safe range.
Test in 30 - 40 min. and repeat the test and feed process until there are 2 consecutive tests where numbers are stable or rising.
Test in an hour and follow the same steps.
DO NOT become complacent. If number have risen after one or two tests, it’s important to continue testing. Numbers may bobble up and down as the HC food and/or Karo wear off. DO NOT get one test where your cat has risen from low numbers into the 50s and go to sleep or leave the house. You are putting your cat in a risky situation. When in doubt, leave HC food out.

In the case of an accidental overdose or should there be symptoms of hypoglycemia, even if you have caught this in the early stages, you may need to monitor for literally 16 or more hours. Lantus and Levemir are long acting types of insulin. This means if your cat is over dose, you will need to stay alert for hours in order to closely monitor and to keep your cat safe.

Please post your numbers. Those people who are helping you will not abandon you. In fact, they are staying up with you. The experienced people will even work in shifts to make sure your cat is safe and you have the support you need. Remember to refresh your browser to see new posts and keep posting so we know all is well.

~ written by Sienne and Gabby
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72, +3 56

20 minutes since 56 reading, Kitty is now 59.

He had a break from eating, but now goes back to the food plate again. So far he's eaten approx 3/4 of one Gourmet Gold (= Fancy Feast) can.
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72, +3 56

ok, so that's basically the same number. i think i wouldn't feed him more right now.

if he needs a dose decrease we want to see him get below 50. it's not dangerous as long as you're monitoring - non-diabetic cats seem to regularly get into the 40's, but with insulin we just want to be safe.

plan to keep retesting him in about 15-20 minute intervals for now. you can keep editing your subject line so others see it as well. i'll keep watching.
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72, +3 56, 40 min later 65

Now 20 minutes later (that is, 40 minutes since +3), Kitty was 65.

I think I will still stay up for one more test....

I find this quite interesting, as Kitty missed 2 shots and he is still having these low numbers! I wonder why this happening?
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72, +3 56, 40 min later 65

it IS interesting. i've asked for opinions for a next dose, so check here before you shoot again.

you can mark these tests on your ss as well. i do something like this:

under the +3 box
56
3.3=59
3.6=65

then you have to color the box yourself. leave the cell highlighted and go to the A that has a dark box around it at the top. mine says "text background color" and click on it. then click on one of the greens to show it's under 100. mine shows the green in the strip under "custom colors."
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72, +3 56, 40 min later 65

i should mention that sometimes that change in food is huge. to a cat that is carb sensitive, a dry kibble or two can send their BG up for hours. it could be that kitty is one of those. you're already seeing a significant drop in the amount of insulin needed.

another test is a good idea. also, would you please post tonight maybe an hour early (before shot) so we can look at the most recent information? thanks!
 
Re: 3/10 Kitty PMPS 202, +2 72, +3 56, 40 min later 65

great job fitting those numbers in!

now go to the top of the ss page, click on the line right in between the +3 and +4, or in the region right above that. on mine there are alphabet letters and i have to click between the alphabet letters labeling each column. you're looking for the icon that has a horizontal line with an arrow on both ends. when you see that icon, hold the "click" down and slide the line over to the right just a tad. that'll make the numbers be visible. at the moment the cell is just a bit too narrow to show all of it.
 
Kitty was now 70 at +4. I think I am now safe to go to sleep, right? :)

I will get up early tomorrow morning and will post one hour before his morning shot so that we can check what's happening before the morning shot.

Thanks a million for helping us here!
I am so glad all of this is happening now before next week when i am travelling (again!)...
 
sounds like a plan. great job tonight! see you in the morning.

i'm glad it happened now too - you can see why we are such fans of testing. if one isn't testing, you simply have no way to know what's going on in the kitter's body. this let's us know exactly what's going on.

sleep well!
 
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