2/17 Blackie - UTI Confirmed

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Ele & Blackie (GA)

Ele & Blackie (GA)

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Well, Blackie's numbers didn't go down yesterday or last night, so we upped the dose again to 2.6 this am. I also stuck his little saucer (it's really a shallow bowl) under his butt in the litter box this morning and hope to hear back on the U/A later today.

He had to watch regular tv last night, still sitting between us. We don't have cable and last night we couldn't get NBC for the Olympics. I was disappointed, but then heard this morning that we didn't win any medals, so I didn't feel so bad.

I'll post later when I hear the U/A results.

I hope everyone is have a good Wednesday.

Edited Subject line to include UTI
 
Re: 2/17 Blackie

I'm sorry Blackie's numbers didn't go down. Hopefully you will hear that he has an infection or this will be the magic dose. Isn't it weird that we sometimes hope for infection? ;)

I bet Blackie missed the Olympics, but at least nothing too exciting happened. Maybe tonight he can watch us win gold. :)

I'll be waiting to hear the u/a results later on. Have a good day!
 
Re: 2/17 Blackie

Yep, UTI confirmed. We're going to use Clavamox this time. My vet wanted to give Convenia, but I had read Dr. Lisa's post on this and said no. He then looked it up on VIN and said that was fine. I also gave him the link to Dr. Lisa's post on Convenia. So that explains why we couldn't keep up with the bg's even when we were raising the dose. I think I causedd it this time by lowering the dose and letting his bg's go high. Any sugar in his urine, is like a petri dish for the bacteria. We can't get a culture because my vet doesn't have lab facilities. He said he would have to have it on a slide within 30 minutes to get culture results. I don't think my old vet could do it that fast either. This is Blackie's 4th UTI since September. I wish I could find a way to stop them. He doesn't act like he's sick or hurting, but I know how painful a UTI can be.
 
Re: 2/17 Blackie

Buzz was on Clavamox at dx. It worked. :)

I am confused as to why your vet doesn't do a cystocentesis? He should be doing it anyway (rather than a free catch, but I know you don't always bring Blackie, just his urine) but for him to say, We have to have it on a slide within 30 minutes, so I can't do a culture seems either ignorant or lazy when there is another, better method of collection available that would allow him to do it. That was the longest sentence ever!

I don't mean to put down your vet, and maybe there is a reason he hasn't done a cystocentesis. I just wanted to mention it because Blackie has so many issues in that area; anything that might help is worth exploring. I am glad you said no to Convenia!

Hopefully the Clavamox will fix him right up and his numbers will start to go down, too. Thanks for peeking in on my condo; I like to see your name over there! Familiar faces and all. :)
 
I must not have said that right. He was saying that even with the cystocentesis, to get a good culture you have to have the urine in a culture media in 30 minutes. He doesn't have the equipment to do a culture in house and would have to send it out. Thus it would be way beyond the 30 minutes. I suspect this is why all of Blackie's other cultures, including the ones done with cystocentesis, came back negative. I could be very wrong about this, but this is my understanding.

Buzz is doing awesome and I am very happy for you. Even with the late nights, you know you're headed in the right direction.
 
It might be worth a trip to a larger vet practice to get a cystocentesis drawn. Especially considering the number of UTIs Blackie is getting. At the very least, I would make sure he gets the cystocentesis done after this round of antibiotics to make sure he's free and clear.
 
Ouch! So sorry to hear about Blackie's UTI. What's the problem with Convenia, btw? I've never heard of it. Think we used Orbax for 3 weeks for Buddha's last UTI. We've used Clavamox before for other ailments. (Thought tangent - when Buddha was little he had a warble in his neck. That was the grossest thing ever.)
 
What's a warble in a neck?! It sounds weird.

Dr. Lisa wrote a post about Convenia, but I can't remember any of the details or even why you should be cautious. I think it might have been on the old board. I can dig around and see if I can find it, and maybe others here have it bookmarked or remember more of the details than I do.
 
Thanks, I maybe did hear about a long acting injectable antibiotic but didn't catch the name. That's good to know.

Warbles are bot fly larvae. The fly lays an egg on an animal and it burrows into the skin and grows and grows and grows. Buddha's was years ago, but I remember that he hadn't been feeling well, maybe a bit of wheezing and maybe swallowing difficulties. I remembering sitting at the table scratching him under the chin and feeling a lump. I looked and saw a little round hole in his neck and while I stared in horror I saw something move inside of it. So I got him to the vet that morning, but the worm disappeared before the vet saw him. There are some graphic pictures of cats with warbles in their necks (just google if you have a strong stomach). I don't remember Buddha looking that bad, but I'm sure they would have cleaned the wound in the back room out of my sight. It took a couple of rounds of antibiotics to clear up, maybe because I was too squeamish to keep the hole properly cleaned.
 
Ele,
I really think you should get a culture and sensitivity either when you are done with this round of abx (like 2 weeks after) OR if/when he gets another UTI. A cysto is relatively easy to do and you can send out the culture so the vet doesn't need any special equip. With all of these courses of abx, I'd be worried about resistance. Just a thought!
 
Awww, hope he is doing better soon! I hadn't heard that about sending out for the culture being bad - that's always how it was done at any vet I was at in the past, though thankfully it's been years since I have needed to get one done. But they did always come back negative, wonder if it was just a total waste of $$$ then. I thought they refrigerated it or something and that was enough, but I never really asked... back then I was so trusting!!!! ohmygod_smile
 
Joanna & Bix said:
I thought they refrigerated it or something and that was enough,
Click to expand...

It is enough if you put it in the correct media. They need to use a port-a-cul tube to get a good result. You ship overnight w/ ice packs. With that said, if the cat has been on several abx courses, you can see a false negative culture.

As an aside, do any of your vets use Baytril for UTIs? It is cleared by the kidney and concentrated in the urine. It has broad spectrum too (considered a "big gun"). Yeah, it can cause retinopathy (sp?) in cats at high doses, but you can go really loooow on the dose for a UTI with great results (because on the concentration in the urine). I wouldn't use it for infection in other tissues in the cat because the therapeutic dose would have to be higher... Just a thought!
 
Thank you everyone for your input. I will talk to my vet about finding a clinic that can do the culture right. I forgot to bring my data to update my spreadsheet, but we raised Blackie's dose this morning to 3 units on an amps of 416. We had to go to 3.2 the last time he had a UTI.

Michele, the Baytril scares me. I had heard of it causing blindness and at Blackie's age, I just didn't want to go there. After the last UTI we did a U/A a week after we stopped the abs and it came back negative. For this reason, I don't think it's the same infection, but rather he's having chronic infections. His higher than normal bg's lately could have caused the infection since he seems so susceptable.
 
Ele & Blackie said:
Michele, the Baytril scares me. I had heard of it causing blindness and at Blackie's age, I just didn't want to go there.
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I understand. (But it is at the high doses I talked about.) Another option would be to put him on low-dose daily antibiotics forever. They do that for human patients with chronic UTIs (especially uncontrolled diabetics). In humans, they use TMS, keflex, amoxi (sometimes), or macrobid. I know that keflex and amoxi are fine in cats. Don't know about the other 2; I'd have to look them up. However, before something like that is done, you need to get a culture. If you consider that route, you'd want to wait 4-6 weeks after ending this course of abx before culturing (or till you have another infection). In dogs, you'd acidify the urine but I'd be wary of doing that in a diabetic cat.

Poor Blackie... :sad:
 
Ele & Blackie said:
After the last UTI we did a U/A a week after we stopped the abs and it came back negative. For this reason, I don't think it's the same infection, but rather he's having chronic infections. His higher than normal bg's lately could have caused the infection since he seems so susceptable.
Click to expand...

The U/A you did after stopping the abs was done through home collection and later analysis at the vets, right? If so, I would seriously consider that he has had a low-grade infection for months now. That's why we're all recommending that you get the cystocentesis done. If the specimen collection is flawed, there's no way the resulting data can be valid.

Lucy has had good success with a antibiotic called zenequin. Clavamox upsets her stomach and I won't agree to the Baytril.
 
Thanks for the clarification, Terri. I will definately see if I can find a vet that can do the cystocentesis/culture. Blackie was on the Zenequin with the last 3 UTI's, so I think that's why the vet wanted to try a different ab. So far, I haven't noticed that it's bothering his stomach, but now that I know what it did with Lucy, I'll watch for it.

Does Lucy have frequent UTI's? I wonder if the CRF doesn't also contribute to this in Blackie. He never had a UTI until he was diagnosed with CRF.
 
The zenequin didn't upset Lucy's stomach--that was the clavamox (liquid and pill forms). However, for each infection, she needed to go through 2 rounds to get the infection totally cleared.

Personally, I think Lucy's problem is that she doesn't pee often enough (twice a day) and things brew around in there while she's lazing in her bed. :)
 
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