12/15 J.D. AMPS 122, PMPS 405
- Thread starter Dyana
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Cheryl and Winnie
Member Since 2009
Re: 12/15 J.D. PM +11.5 110 Dose Advise Please
He looks like he usually pops up after his +11 and ps for his +1s and +2s. and he gets a bounce after greens and low-mid blues. I think he would be ok at his reg dose.
BUT it is your cat and YOUR comfort level.
If you don't feel comfortable shooting and will be gone all day worrying --- then cut the dose.
and you'll get the chance on a day you will be home to shoot lower numbers.
It's up to you.What do you think after looking at those numbers?
ETA-- it's not just the kitty's liver learning to accept lower numbers. You have to learn to do so too !
You've got some great data -- good job, keep it up ! But as I said, in the end you are the one there that has to feel comfortable . It can be just as much of a lesson to give a BCS dose as to shoot BOS.
He looks like he usually pops up after his +11 and ps for his +1s and +2s. and he gets a bounce after greens and low-mid blues. I think he would be ok at his reg dose.
BUT it is your cat and YOUR comfort level.
If you don't feel comfortable shooting and will be gone all day worrying --- then cut the dose.
and you'll get the chance on a day you will be home to shoot lower numbers.
It's up to you.What do you think after looking at those numbers?
ETA-- it's not just the kitty's liver learning to accept lower numbers. You have to learn to do so too !
You've got some great data -- good job, keep it up ! But as I said, in the end you are the one there that has to feel comfortable . It can be just as much of a lesson to give a BCS dose as to shoot BOS.
Cheryl and Winnie
Member Since 2009
Re: 12/15 J.D. PM +11.5 110 Dose Advise Please
D-- did you test again?
I was editing my orig post a smidge when you came back on.so you might want to recheck it.
D-- did you test again?
I was editing my orig post a smidge when you came back on.so you might want to recheck it.
Tena and Curry(GA)
Member Since 2010
Re: 12/15 J.D. PM +11.5 110 Dose Advise Please
No advise from me....too new to provide useful information for ya....just support and a bump.
No advise from me....too new to provide useful information for ya....just support and a bump.
Cheryl and Winnie
Member Since 2009
Re: 12/15 J.D. PM +11.5 110 Dose Advise Please
maybe this will help you -- from the getting data ready to shoot lower ps sticky:
Q4.4. My cat's pre-shot level was way below the usual value. Should I give the injection?
A4.4. There's no hard and fast rule, but if you don't have data on how your cat responds to insulin, here are some general guidelines. Below 150 mg/dl (8.3 mmol/L), don't give insulin. Between 150 and 200 (8.3-11.1 mmol/L), you have three options: a.) give nothing; b.) give a token dose (10-25% of the usual dose); c.) feed as usual, test in a couple of hours, and make a decision based on that value. Above 200 (11.1 mmol/L) but below the cat's normal pre-shot value, a reduced dose might be wise. In all cases, if you are reducing or eliminating insulin, it's wise to check for ketones in the urine. Above the normal pre-shot value, give the usual dose, but if the pre-shot value is consistently elevated, it's a good idea to schedule a full glucose curve to see whether a change in dose or insulin is appropriate. In most cases, the target "peak" value should not be below 100 mg/dl (5.6 mmol/L), and for some cats it might be higher.
Keep in mind that these are general guidelines, and they should be personalized to your own cat's reactions to insulin. If your experience is that your cat does not became hypoglycemic with a dose which is close to her usual, then your experience should be your guide.
Lantus and Levemir users: Because Lantus and Levemir are gentler insulins, you may find that these guidelines are stricter than you need.
WHAT IF YOU ARE NOT A NEWBIE? Let's talk specifically for Lantus and Levemir. This is about fine tuning your curves.
Are you data ready to handle a lower preshot number?
This is where the very early cycle spot checks (those +1's, +2's) and those very late cycle spot checks (the +10's, +11's) come into play. Call them the "neglected" spot checks. Everyone gets those +6 spot checks, but there is a reason to collect data in the very early and very late part of the cycle.
Say you get a preshot of 150. Well if you've collected the data on the average time it takes the insulin to start having any effect for your cat and what happens after +12, then you might see that shooting a 150 is actually very safe in your cat. Kitty will be in the 200's before the insulin starts working. You are then using the lag time (aka overlap and carryover) between shooting and effect time to your advantage.
So why the +10's and +11's? Well say you are on day 5 of a dose increase change and your storage shed is now not only full, it is overflowing... and your +10 or +11 was way higher than your preshot. Good way to stay out of trouble cause now you know you would have shot a still dropping number, not a good idea. so what is the plan then?.... keep testing, and not 2 hours later, every 20-30 minutes would be better, so you can catch the minute it turns and do not loose all your overlap. If you miss the rise and cat is way up there BG wise before you shoot, remember the number is just going to continue to rise in those hours before the insulin has a chance to kick in, and you have a roller coaster curve going rather than the flat curve that is ideal.
Also some Lantus and Levemir users notice a dip at the end of the cycle, meaning that their preshot is always a bit lower than their +10 or +11. It is important to know if your cat is one of those because if you are not raising your dose because your PS doesn't seem to call for it, yet your nadir is not so hot... this could be the reason why.
To save cat's ears, really the +8's and +9's and the +4's and +5's are the numbers that yield the least amount of important data once you have well established the nadir in your cat. Yes, get them here or there on spot checks, but do not forget to get the "neglected" spot checks... the very early and very late parts of cycle. They are more useful than most realize.
Know thy cat. Be data ready to handle the situation.
~ written by jojo and bunny(GA) and Y
maybe this will help you -- from the getting data ready to shoot lower ps sticky:
Q4.4. My cat's pre-shot level was way below the usual value. Should I give the injection?
A4.4. There's no hard and fast rule, but if you don't have data on how your cat responds to insulin, here are some general guidelines. Below 150 mg/dl (8.3 mmol/L), don't give insulin. Between 150 and 200 (8.3-11.1 mmol/L), you have three options: a.) give nothing; b.) give a token dose (10-25% of the usual dose); c.) feed as usual, test in a couple of hours, and make a decision based on that value. Above 200 (11.1 mmol/L) but below the cat's normal pre-shot value, a reduced dose might be wise. In all cases, if you are reducing or eliminating insulin, it's wise to check for ketones in the urine. Above the normal pre-shot value, give the usual dose, but if the pre-shot value is consistently elevated, it's a good idea to schedule a full glucose curve to see whether a change in dose or insulin is appropriate. In most cases, the target "peak" value should not be below 100 mg/dl (5.6 mmol/L), and for some cats it might be higher.
Keep in mind that these are general guidelines, and they should be personalized to your own cat's reactions to insulin. If your experience is that your cat does not became hypoglycemic with a dose which is close to her usual, then your experience should be your guide.
Lantus and Levemir users: Because Lantus and Levemir are gentler insulins, you may find that these guidelines are stricter than you need.
WHAT IF YOU ARE NOT A NEWBIE? Let's talk specifically for Lantus and Levemir. This is about fine tuning your curves.
Are you data ready to handle a lower preshot number?
This is where the very early cycle spot checks (those +1's, +2's) and those very late cycle spot checks (the +10's, +11's) come into play. Call them the "neglected" spot checks. Everyone gets those +6 spot checks, but there is a reason to collect data in the very early and very late part of the cycle.
Say you get a preshot of 150. Well if you've collected the data on the average time it takes the insulin to start having any effect for your cat and what happens after +12, then you might see that shooting a 150 is actually very safe in your cat. Kitty will be in the 200's before the insulin starts working. You are then using the lag time (aka overlap and carryover) between shooting and effect time to your advantage.
So why the +10's and +11's? Well say you are on day 5 of a dose increase change and your storage shed is now not only full, it is overflowing... and your +10 or +11 was way higher than your preshot. Good way to stay out of trouble cause now you know you would have shot a still dropping number, not a good idea. so what is the plan then?.... keep testing, and not 2 hours later, every 20-30 minutes would be better, so you can catch the minute it turns and do not loose all your overlap. If you miss the rise and cat is way up there BG wise before you shoot, remember the number is just going to continue to rise in those hours before the insulin has a chance to kick in, and you have a roller coaster curve going rather than the flat curve that is ideal.
Also some Lantus and Levemir users notice a dip at the end of the cycle, meaning that their preshot is always a bit lower than their +10 or +11. It is important to know if your cat is one of those because if you are not raising your dose because your PS doesn't seem to call for it, yet your nadir is not so hot... this could be the reason why.
To save cat's ears, really the +8's and +9's and the +4's and +5's are the numbers that yield the least amount of important data once you have well established the nadir in your cat. Yes, get them here or there on spot checks, but do not forget to get the "neglected" spot checks... the very early and very late parts of cycle. They are more useful than most realize.
Know thy cat. Be data ready to handle the situation.
~ written by jojo and bunny(GA) and Y
Dyana
Member Since 2009
Re: 12/15 J.D. PM +11.5 110, AMPS 122
Thanks for all the information Cheryl and for being her for me and for the advise and encouragement.
Unfortunately, I am rather a chicken, when I'm gone all day. When I'm home, I'll hoot almost anything.
I only read your first post after getting out the shower and trying to wake up a little. I did not feel comfortable shooting the full dose and being gone from +1 to PMPS. I feel like this dose is just beginning to show signs of good things, but I have no data of low numbers on this dose. Last night was our first green. The first thing I did after reading your 1st response to me, was to look at my ss to try to find a comparible number that I've shot at on this dose, and there were none.
I went to measure the dose, drew 1.5 units, pushed the air out and it looked like a f1.00, but upon closer inspection it was what I would call a s1.25, I guess.
Yesterday, I left out extra food and it was all gone when I got home from work (which is very unusual). Today I will leave out extra extra food, I guess.
Now, I'll go back and read your posts and information you gave me again. Thanks
Thanks for all the information Cheryl and for being her for me and for the advise and encouragement.
Unfortunately, I am rather a chicken, when I'm gone all day. When I'm home, I'll hoot almost anything.
I only read your first post after getting out the shower and trying to wake up a little. I did not feel comfortable shooting the full dose and being gone from +1 to PMPS. I feel like this dose is just beginning to show signs of good things, but I have no data of low numbers on this dose. Last night was our first green. The first thing I did after reading your 1st response to me, was to look at my ss to try to find a comparible number that I've shot at on this dose, and there were none.
I went to measure the dose, drew 1.5 units, pushed the air out and it looked like a f1.00, but upon closer inspection it was what I would call a s1.25, I guess.
Yesterday, I left out extra food and it was all gone when I got home from work (which is very unusual). Today I will leave out extra extra food, I guess.
Now, I'll go back and read your posts and information you gave me again. Thanks
Cheryl and Winnie
Member Since 2009
Re: 12/15 J.D. PM +11.5 110, AMPS 122
Since you weren't comfortable, you did the right thing. I
As I wrote in my post -- you can learn just as much from shooting a BCS as you can BOS.
yes there will be some shed adjustment. but as the saying goes, if he got down there once, he'll get there again.
hopefully next time on a day off
Have a happy cat day JD !
-- you too Dyana
Since you weren't comfortable, you did the right thing. I
As I wrote in my post -- you can learn just as much from shooting a BCS as you can BOS.
yes there will be some shed adjustment. but as the saying goes, if he got down there once, he'll get there again.
hopefully next time on a day off
Have a happy cat day JD !
-- you too Dyana
Dyana
Member Since 2009
Re: 12/15 J.D. PM +11.5 110 Dose Advise Please
I need to write this ten times
you can learn just as much from shooting a BCS as you can BOS
you can learn just as much from shooting a BCS as you can BOS
you can learn just as much from shooting a BCS as you can BOS
I'm trying to get that into my head.
I will have a week off starting next Tuesday, so I'll get some practice then
In the mean time, I think you're right I need to learn to shoot lower numbers and go to work nailbite_smile and like it. HA!
Off to get ready for tbp..
Cheryl and Winnie said:
I need to write this ten times
you can learn just as much from shooting a BCS as you can BOS
you can learn just as much from shooting a BCS as you can BOS
you can learn just as much from shooting a BCS as you can BOS
I'm trying to get that into my head.
I will have a week off starting next Tuesday, so I'll get some practice then
In the mean time, I think you're right I need to learn to shoot lower numbers and go to work nailbite_smile and like it. HA!
Off to get ready for tbp..
Iorwen & Tray
Member Since 2010
Re: 12/15 J.D. PM +11.5 110, AMPS 122, +1 152
I remember being a chicken too, so don't feel bad, until we get some experience with these low amps we don't know how to handle it.
good luck with J.D. today
I remember being a chicken too, so don't feel bad, until we get some experience with these low amps we don't know how to handle it.
good luck with J.D. today
Michelle and Mannie (GA)
Member Since 2009
Re: 12/15 J.D. PM +11.5 110, AMPS 122, +1 152
greetings from another member of the chicken club, been there too. One has to do what one is comfortable with - especially when you will be gone all day. Really nice numbers yesterday for JD. YAY! :mrgreen:
greetings from another member of the chicken club, been there too. One has to do what one is comfortable with - especially when you will be gone all day. Really nice numbers yesterday for JD. YAY! :mrgreen:
Barbara and tuffy
Member Since 2009
Re: 12/15 J.D. PM +11.5 110, AMPS 122, +1 152
Safety first. I think you did the right thing for whatever that is worth. Have a good day. I hope you get some rest. Yea, I'm up an running at full speed. Incredible.
Safety first. I think you did the right thing for whatever that is worth. Have a good day. I hope you get some rest. Yea, I'm up an running at full speed. Incredible.
Re: 12/15 J.D. PM +11.5 110, AMPS 122, +1 152
I am so with you Dyana! I am nervous Nellie enough about shooting a low PS when I know I'm going to be there to monitor and have all I need to do so. But if I were leaving...no way....I'd do just what you did.
I am so with you Dyana! I am nervous Nellie enough about shooting a low PS when I know I'm going to be there to monitor and have all I need to do so. But if I were leaving...no way....I'd do just what you did.
Ella & Rusty & Stu(GA)
Member Since 2010
You did good, Dyana! Now you both can relax and J.D. can come back down.
Ella & Rusty
Ella & Rusty
Libby and Lucy
Member Since 2009
J.D., enough with the bouncies! Let's try something new. Jazzy says to try FLAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT. It feels good and earns you fewer pokies.
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