11/10 Noni PMPS~299+2~265+4~202+6~135+8~139

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asoolty

asoolty

Member Since 2010
Good Morning ,


happy to tell you that Noni is gaining back her strength a little, eager to lick her tummy .. purring last night when I put her on my bed. been counting her breathing rate, it slow down to 33/mins which is normal i assume.

Now her AM shot is due in 3 hours time, I would like to stick with the dose (1.5), what do you advice ?


P.S. New avatar :RAHCAT

Previous Condo:
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=82828
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268

It's great news that Noni is getting back to her old self. I hope you have a wonderful Caterday with lots of kitty kisses.
mary and oliver
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268

I'm so glad that Noni is feeling better :-D
The avatar is purrfect. It's so nice to see her face. I could not see her cute face in the other avatar.

Since you've been shooting the 1.50 units, I would stick with that for another day and see how she does. Lantus works best with consistancy. I am thinking that if she needs to go up in dose, then we'll ask you to try to measure in 0.25 unit increments.

For now, good luck with this dose, and enjoy your purring kitty :razz:
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268

ecurie said:
It's great news that Noni is getting back to her old self. I hope you have a wonderful Caterday with lots of kitty kisses.
mary and oliver
Click to expand...


Thank you Mary :YMHUG:
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268

Dyana said:
I'm so glad that Noni is feeling better :-D
The avatar is purrfect. It's so nice to see her face. I could not see her cute face in the other avatar.

Since you've been shooting the 1.50 units, I would stick with that for another day and see how she does. Lantus works best with consistancy. I am thinking that if she needs to go up in dose, then we'll ask you to try to measure in 0.25 unit increments.

For now, good luck with this dose, and enjoy your purring kitty :razz:
Click to expand...


Thank you Dyana,

yea I notice now that the other avatar wasn't giving her justice, shes pretty when she's herself, that's my Noni in the avatar.
I will keep with this dose now, and keep testing.. please let me know when it needs an increase, I think I can measure that too.

I just inject her with the antibiotic dose, it's a really long needle so hard to inject, unlike the tiny syringes we use for insulin, thank god I don't have to do this for long.

now she's upset and hating me for not letting her go near the stitches :lol:
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268

She looks like an angel and a devil all rolled into one, just like a calico :lol:
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Love the new avatar and am glad she is doing well! I agree with Dyana - keep with the current dose till she has had 6 doses (3 days) of 1.5 and then re-evaluate. Meanwhile try and get the nadirs between now and then because thats what you will be using to make the dose decision.

Here is the protocol below - I deleted the bits that don't apply in this case.

"General" Guidelines:
Each subsequent dose is held for a minimum of 3 days (6 consecutive cycles) unless kitty earns a reduction (See: Reducing the dose...).

Increasing the dose:
Hold the dose for 3 - 5 days (6 - 10 consecutive cycles) if nadirs are less than 200 before increasing the dose by 0.25 unit.
After 3 days (6 consecutive cycles)... if nadirs are greater than 200, but less than 300 increase the dose by 0.25 unit.
After 3 days (6 consecutive cycles)... if nadirs are greater than 300 increase the dose by 0.5 unit.

Reducing the dose:
If kitty drops below 40 (long term diabetic) or 50 (newly diagnosed diabetic) reduce the dose by 0.25 unit. If kitty has a history of not holding reductions well or if reductions are close together... sneak the dose down by shaving the dose rather than reducing by a full quarter unit. Alternatively, at each newly reduced dose... try to make sure kitty maintains numbers in the normal range for seven days before reducing the dose further.
If an attempted reduction fails, go right back up to the last good dose
Click to expand...
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Good morning. I'm glad that Noni is starting to get back to her normal self,purring and in the blue numbers.

The new Avitar looks great.

Have a great day.
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Hi Aseel!!!!

It's great to hear Noni is feeling better and she is ADORABLE!! I love her little face!!

A couple things....I agree with Dyana to hold the dose for now. I don't agree with Wendy that you should hold the dose for six cycles and then reevaluate. She was just in the 60s yesterday. Obviously, if she earns a reduction, you need to reduce.

The other thing that has me nailbite_smile nailbite_smile nailbite_smile is I noticed your vet gave her MetaCam for pain. MetaCam has a black box warning for cats in the U.S. In other words....it "can" cause kidney issues. Please do not allow your vet to give
her any more MetaCam. I'm concerned the dose she gave by syringe is long lasting. Most of us here will not allow our vets to give our cats anything that is long lasting because once it is in, it's in....you can't get it back out.

I hope this addresses Noni's pain. If she starts to act like she is in pain again, see if the vet can give you either buprenorphine or tramadol. But no more MetaCam.

Hugs...you are doing great with her.
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Thanks everyone for helping me here, and thank you for your sweet world about Noni, looks like everyone liking her new avatar pretty girl

Marje you got me worried too, I have one syringe of that painkiller with me now, and been ask by the vet o call before using that, cuz she already injected her yesterday, and told me not to use before 48-72 hrs and before asking her permission.

no other painkiller was available as she claimed ! plz tell me whats the side effect on her now ?

about the dose she's in blue all day now, isn't that just better that the green ? meaning the the dose is perfect for her isn't it ... ?
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

I want to reinforce a couple of Dyana's and Marje's points.

  • When a cat's nadirs are less than 200, the dose can be held for 5 days/10 cycles unless a reduction is warranted.
  • Most of us do not allow our vets to prescribe Metacam. The Federal Drug Agency (FDA) here in the US regulates prescription medication for humans and animals. Due to it's causing renal failure in cats, Metacam (meloxicam) has been given a "black box" warning. This is the strongest action the FDA will take short of recalling a drug. Like Marje, I would ask your vet to not prescribe Metacam or any nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory medication for pain. Rather, medications like buprenophine are as effective and do not carry the same risk for side effects.
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Aseel

There is nothing you can do now about the shot that is in. If she starts having pain again, I'd ask the vet about the drugs I mentioned. If she says there isn't anything else, then it's your decision. I'm going to hope that the shot she gave will be enough to address any
pain for Noni. My former vet gave her cat a small dose of MetaCam every day for years and the cat lived to be 21. So some cats will do ok on it but since I know of the risk, I choose to not use it. You did not know about the risk and so you couldn't have made an informed decision. Since she only got one shot, then don't worry.

Normal numbers are 50-120. So that's the goal for a dose....one that gets Noni in that range. If this dose going forward only keeps her in blue, we will want you to increase at some point as Dyana suggested.
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Sienne and Gabby said:
I want to reinforce a couple of Dyana's and Marje's points.

  • When a cat's nadirs are less than 200, the dose can be held for 5 days/10 cycles unless a reduction is warranted.
  • Most of us do not allow our vets to prescribe Metacam. The Federal Drug Agency (FDA) here in the US regulates prescription medication for humans and animals. Due to it's causing renal failure in cats, Metacam (meloxicam) has been given a "black box" warning. This is the strongest action the FDA will take short of recalling a drug. Like Marje, I would ask your vet to not prescribe Metacam or any nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory medication for pain. Rather, medications like buprenophine are as effective and do not carry the same risk for side effects.
Click to expand...


about Metacam, she had never given Metacam before ? I mean would it harm if only used one or two times?
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Aseel

See my post above Sienne's. I just wanted you to be aware of the issues with MetaCam. I think you should just move forward, check and see what other pain meds might be available, and try not to worry. My intention was not to freak you out but to draw your attention to the use of MetaCam so you could decide whether you want to continue it's use or find something else. I don't think anyone knows how much MetaCam might or might not affect a specific cat. Like I said, my former vet gave her cat a low dose daily for years.
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Marje and Gracie said:
Aseel

See my post above Sienne's. I just wanted you to be aware of the issues with MetaCam. I think you should just move forward, check and see what other pain meds might be available, and try not to worry. My intention was not to freak you out but to draw your attention to the use of MetaCam so you could decide whether you want to continue it's use or find something else. I don't think anyone knows how much MetaCam might or might not affect a specific cat. Like I said, my former vet gave her cat a low dose daily for years.
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Oh, I'm relieved .. she was In too much pain yesterday that was effecting her breathing, I think the vet has no other choice it was the only painkiller she got I think. I'm calling other hospitals tomorrow and ask if they have buprenphine or any other painkiller.

I have one more syringe filled with MetaCam. I don't think I will use it anymore .. nailbite_smile
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Yes...I'd call around. The options are buprenorphine, buprenex, or tramadol. They usually have to be compounded at a special pharmacy. Be sure you check with us on the dosage first, ok? If they aren't used to dosing a little cat, they could give her too much.

Also...keep in mind that your vet MIGHT know about these. I've found some vets in the US will automatically reach for the Metacam first; you have to specifically ask for something else.
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Marje and Gracie said:
Yes...I'd call around. The options are buprenorphine, buprenex, or tramadol. They usually have to be compounded at a special pharmacy. Be sure you check with us on the dosage first, ok? If they aren't used to dosing a little cat, they could give her too much.

Also...keep in mind that your vet MIGHT know about these. I've found some vets in the US will automatically reach for the Metacam first; you have to specifically ask for something else.
Click to expand...


I did ask her for anything , like the one Giving to Tiggy as Wendy told me, she said we don't have that, and then when I've seen a needle I asked for a tables or liquid painkiller, also negative, only MetaCam. she also mentioned that it's not supposed to be used too much as I asked "only one syringe" she said its very dangerous of over used.

I will call and check around tomorrow, wish me luck.


I have a question: dose any kind of human painkillers work on cats, as I've been reading that most are poisonous but there are some few kinds that can be used on cats ?
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

There are some analgesics that can be used. For example, Fentanyl (duragesic) patches are used on both humans and cats. Most opiates can be used. There are medications like aspirin that are poisonous to cats. Buprenorphine can be given as either a subcutaneous shot (like Lantus) or the same liquid can be given orally (either under the tongue or in the cheek pocket) using a syringe without a needle.

Metacam can be used but the dosing has to be very precise based on the weight of the cat and it should not be given frequently. The difficulty is as Marje pointed out -- some vets use it routinely for pain management because they don't "believe" the FDA warning. Personally, I won't allow my vet to use Metacam with my cats.
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Sienne and Gabby said:
There are some analgesics that can be used. For example, Fentanyl (duragesic) patches are used on both humans and cats. Most opiates can be used. There are medications like aspirin that are poisonous to cats. Buprenorphine can be given as either a subcutaneous shot (like Lantus) or the same liquid can be given orally (either under the tongue or in the cheek pocket) using a syringe without a needle.

Metacam can be used but the dosing has to be very precise based on the weight of the cat and it should not be given frequently. The difficulty is as Marje pointed out -- some vets use it routinely for pain management because they don't "believe" the FDA warning. Personally, I won't allow my vet to use Metacam with my cats.
Click to expand...


Thank you Sienne, the amount was based on her weight that's true as the vet checked the file and the weight was 4.7Kg I also told her that she might be less by now because of the operation. The amont is 0.2 in the size on "1ml syringe" and when I asked for more pain killer she said that's only she can give as its not good to be over used.


So only the one time she injected yesterday, and another one to be used after 48-72, and the vet also preferred it to be only used after 72 hrs after calling her.

I think Noni now is gaining her strength so hopefully she won't be needing painkillers as tomorrow is the forth day after operation and she started to move around in the house.
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Hi there, I know you are in Kuwait and don't have a lot of options regarding painkillers and vets. Lets hope she doesn't need the next dose of metacam but if she starts doing the heavy breathing etc again call your vet and ask about other pain management options as everyone has discussed above.

Worst case if there is nothing else and she is in pain, and your vet agrees, then i would give her the metacam, this is just a temporary solution to get her recovered from the operation and she should be recovering anyway. You won't be using it long term.

Kuwait needs some good vets!
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

I agree with Wendy, and those have been my thoughts.

I now have No Metacam and No Convenia written in both my cat's charts at every vet we go to.
But, when J.D. got his dental back in 2009 (before the Black Box Warning), my vet absolutely insisted on using Metcam. I told him like 3 times, I didn't want metacam, but he gave it anyway, after the dental surgery. And, I was given prefilled syringes of Metacam to give him as pain killer, even though I stomped my feet and insisted on buprenex. I gave him one .2 cc dose of Metacam the next day after his surgery (as I was instructed to give it to him, I don't remember anymore, how often), and never gave him anymore. I hope that Noni will not need any more, and if she does, then that may be all you have to help her. J.D. just had a few teeth pulled, I'm sure Noni's surgery hurts more and will take longer to heal than a few pulled teeth.
I would try to call around to the other vets and see if there is any available alternative to Metacam, and tell them you know about the Black Box Warning, and are very concerned.
 
Re: 11/10 Noni AMPS~268+3~180

Wendy&Tiggy said:
Hi there, I know you are in Kuwait and don't have a lot of options regarding painkillers and vets. Lets hope she doesn't need the next dose of metacam but if she starts doing the heavy breathing etc again call your vet and ask about other pain management options as everyone has discussed above.

Worst case if there is nothing else and she is in pain, and your vet agrees, then i would give her the metacam, this is just a temporary solution to get her recovered from the operation and she should be recovering anyway. You won't be using it long term.

Kuwait needs some good vets!
Click to expand...


We truly need to get people here more educated about pets first Wendy, here in Kuwait there is more animal abuse and homeless cats than I've ever seen, and now it's dogs too. Thank god that now we have more animal hospitals than it used to be when I first adopt Noni, there were only two options as I remember, and both are not specialized. Just the minimume like vaccines and so..

Thank god that Noni is safe with us..

Even her previous type of insulin I had to travel to Dubai to get it, or ask my friends to get it for her, cuz it was animal insulin not to be used for human and the vet didnt have it


So unless she's in real pain and I have no other option I will use it, other wise she seems good without painkiller
 
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