10/01/13 Jerry AMPS 154 + 6 218

[HappyCat]

Today and yesterday my AM NADIRS have been higher than his shot readings it's usually the other way around but he definitely likes to keep me guessing!
I do have a health related question if anyone would like to help me try to sort this out. As I've mentioned Jerry is now on a Friskies Pate diet. Previously he had been on Purina 1 in the blue bag. They keep doing new flavors but he started with Sensitive Systems, we've also used the hairball variety, we had also tried the newest healthy metabolism for spayed and neutered cats. I don't know if I'm the only to notice but with different kibbles shedding can be better or worse. I really loved Purina 1 because it REALLY cut down on shedding. Now that I'm on his pate diet he's crazy shedding. I know we've had this problem previously but his coat (now vibrantly filled with his colors again) is kind of thin in the sense of it doesn't brush. I can spend 15 minutes trying to brush him and I don't get anything out but dander but I run my hands down his sides and POOF covered in an obscene amount of cat hair. Purina disappointed me as I contacted them about him being diabetic telling them that I like their product he's just not supposed to have it and did they have anything better, 2 weeks later all they have is stuff located at the vet which they couldn't tell me how much better it is carb wise so hence the pate diet. It's frustrating for laundry and vacuuming but also frustrating to wonder is he not getting all the nutrition that he needs. Purina pretty well runs a monopoly on cat stuff anyway but just thought I'd seek any available input. Thank you!

 

[Chris & China (GA)]

I don't know what to say about the shedding because Purina doesn't make a dry food low enough in carbs for our diabetic kitties (that I know of) and I took all 3 of mine off a very high quality dry when China was diagnosed.

As for the dose though, on the AM cycle on 9/27, is there a reason you didn't take the reduction? Any result under 50 usually means a reduction of .25 in dose. It's also possible that sometime during the AM dose on 9/28 Jerry dropped below the 82, so the higher numbers you're seeing could be from a bounce from those low readings.

Bouncing happens when the liver "panics" and sends hormones and glucose into the bloodstream to bring the numbers back up to where it's "used to" being. They can take 72 hours to clear. As you get Jerry under better control, the bounces won't go as high, and will clear faster. China used to bounce into the 400's and take the full 72 hours to clear, but now she usually only bounces into the 200's and she clears them within one cycle.

This time of the year Jerry could also be shedding in advance of his winter coat coming in. Hope you find out what's going on, or at least his coat comes in nice, thick and soft for winter!

 

[rhiannon and shadow (GA)]

Well if Marje were here, she'd tell you about coconut oil.
http://www.tropicaltraditions.com/virgin_coconut_oil.htm
start with .25ml and worked up.
It helps with hairballs, and it makes their coats much nicer and should help with the dandruff. ( The dandruff will also get better if you make it to remission)

 

[HappyCat]

Coconut oil, interesting. Certainly worth a try thank you! I hadn't ever made the connection of dander and diabetes but does make sense as he's the only kitty who visibly has it. I truly learn something new every day here!
In regards to kibble Purina probably doesn't make anything suitable probably why I didn't get a more direct answer. Up until 3 months ago when I self and later vet diagnosed him I didn't know feline diabetes even existed. So this is all before and after observations. Like friskies kibble had bad shedding, regular purina not so great, purina one got much better, now shedding again. It is fall now but has been hot so I hope he improves as weather gets more seasonal.
The dose decrease didn't occur to me, it was the day I always feared so in my frenzy I had overlooked it in the information and was told after the fact I should've decreased the night dose but since it was days later there was no going back. Is it supposed to be a permanent decrease? I'm not great with dosing or interpreting what the numbers are telling me. 3 days is about the just of what I know which makes sense as I started hitting high day nadirs within 3 days of his 40. No one seems to know about lantus here, people doctors maybe but not vets. For instance he was started by the vet on 3 units which would've done him in when he hit 40 at 1.75. He didn't seem to have his best numbers until his increase to 1.75 so I'm not sure if he's where he should be or what to do. So as always we value any input.

 

[Chris & China (GA)]

Is it supposed to be a permanent decrease?

No..if you get a reading below 50, you decrease it .25 and hold that dose for 6-10 cycles to see how they do. If they continue to have "normal" numbers for a week, you can try going down another .25 until you're down to .25...then you can go down to .1 before trying an OJT trial.

If their numbers go back up after 6-10 cycles on the reduced dose, then you'd go back up to the last dose that was working. If you look at China's spreadsheet, you'll see she got 2 reductions really close together, but it looks like the 2nd on isn't going to work for her, so she'll be going back up to .75 soon. If the .75 drops her below 40 again (or below 50 on 3 separate cycles), then her "perfect" dose might be somewhere between .75 and .5

A lot of us are in the same boat with vets too. China's vet wanted her started on 3 units...and she dropped to a 22 on .75 (not even 1 unit so his 3 units would have probably killed her) I'm so thrilled I found this site before I ever shot any insulin or I'm afraid I would have lost her

You should go ahead and hold the 1.75 until we're sure the bounce has cleared (another 3 cycles), and then if Jerry's nadir is still at numbers above "normal diabetic numbers", he might need an increase to 2 units. Until the bounce clears, there's no way to know if he'll need a higher dose..or even a lower one.

Let's see how his numbers look in a couple days.
Hope the coconut oil works! I know a lot of people use it for hairballs too!

 

[Wendy&Neko]

Here is the link to your previous condo. For each new post, could you please include this as it allows us to go back and look at what was said previously. To do the link, go to your old condo, go to the URL section of your web browser and copy the text, go back to the new condo, click on the URL button and paste the URL in there.

In your previous condo, both Sienne and I suggested that you should reduce Jerry's dose because of the 40 you got a few days ago. This means going down to 1.5 units until Jerry either decides either it's not enough (wait at least 6 cycles to see if the reduction is holding before increasing back to 1.75) or if he earns another reduction. Sometimes high numbers in the middle of a cycle can mean too high a dose. If after the 6 cycles of the reduced 1.5 dose you see low blues and greens, I'd give the dose a few more cycles to see if it will work.

What type of brushes are you using with Jerry? I use a combination of a comb, furminator for the undercoat and zoom groom to get rid of the loose fur. Often when cats switch to a better quality food, they shed their old coats for a better one. What you could be seeing with Jerry is this process happening. Hopefully once he's gotten his better coat in, the shedding should go back to normal.