1/28 Sami - PMPS 77; +1 98; +2 78; +2.5 75

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Tina & Sammy

Tina & Sammy

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Yesterday's condo

Sorry for the late post, after giving Sami her AM shot, and getting ready for work, I went back to bed. These late nights and getting up multiple times a night are really starting to catch up with me. But I love the numbers we are seeing. If I didn't get up at 4:00 am this morning I wouldn't have seen that Sami was at 138. And that was at +9.5, so there is a possibility that she saw some green earlier in her cycle. I guess that means that tonight I need to check at the +6 to see where she is.

Today Sami is doing great, having started out the day with a 215, which is the lowest she has seen for an AMPS, she is now down to 96 at +6. Finally some green!

With this progress it looks like I will be sticking with the 1.5 unit dose for a full 7 days before I try to make any changes, that is as long as she doesn't go too low. Plus, I am trying to work Sami's shot time back another hour and 15 minutes so I don't want to cause some double trouble by moving the shot time back and adding an increase. I should be able to get the shot time where I want it by Saturday.

By moving the shot time I can get more readings before I have to go to bed which can alert me if I need to stay up or check more often over night. Plus, I hope to be leaving Sami home from work starting next week, and by having an earlier shot time I can get a +3 reading before heading to work, and if she looks like she is going to drop too low then I can cart her with me to the office to monitor her more closely.

So needless to say, Sami is great, I am great, and I am hoping to see some more green today.

WCR: Sami is friskier than ever. Just about every time I get set up to do her test she wants to run off with the lancet tool, and a few times she has gone after the strips. She is more lovable then ever too. She always wants to sit on my lap, which makes it very difficult to work when she is at the office with me, most of the morning my boss and the other guys are in the office so I can't exactly hold and cuddle her the whole time. Once they leave the office we can have more quite time together.

Hope everyone has as great a day as we are having right now. It is mighty cold outside and today I am thankful that I don’t have to be outside.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; +2.5 191; +4.5 127; +6 96

What nice numbers :)

Moving the shot times so that you can get in +3's before heading off to tbp and bed is wonderful. :) Sometimes our eyes get so heavy it is hard to stay up/get back up for testing!

I hope Sami continues to have better numbahs!
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; +2.5 191; +4.5 127; +6 96

I'd suggest getting a +8 to see if Sami is still dropping or if her numbers are coming up. I'm assuming you are giving her a few bites of food to keep the surf going? Her numbers are very pretty both last night and today. Don't be upset if Sami bounces. This is the first greens you've gotten and it would not be at all unexpected if her liver decides to panic.

Moving the shot times the way you've described makes a lot of sense.

Great job today.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; +2.5 191; +4.5 127; +6 96

What a great kitty report! And exciting numbers too. This is always such a reward to see kitties feeling good. Sienne is right about the possibility of a bounce later, but you know by now that it is a normal response to lower numbers and this bouncy response eventually gets less and less as your kitty gets used to the greens.

Anyway I just wanted to say good work and hug that kitty some more!
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; +2.5 191; +4.5 127; +6 96

Sami is doing great today, Tina. I like when Mally's numbers drop steadily like Sami's are doing today. To me it seems like it's much easier on their system.

I was up at 4:00 AM too for a test. With the way Mally's AM cycles have been going, I keep expecting her PM cycles to lower but it hasn't been the case yet.

It's so nice that you are able to take Sami to work with you. It gives you peace of mind and Sami gets to be with you all day!
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; +2.5 191; +4.5 127; +6 96

Hi Tina,
What a great day for Sammi and how you and her are feeling good. Also loved the report that she tried to run off with the lancet device, what a little rascal.
Have a great day,
Mike & Bo (1/12/10)
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; +2.5 191; +4.5 127; +6 96

Sami is doing Fabulous! Congrats Tina!! I am so happy for you both!!

:RAHCAT :RAHCAT :RAHCAT
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; +2.5 191; +4.5 127; +6 96; +9 77

Recap:
AMPS = 215
+2.5 = 191
+4.5 = 127
+6 = 96
+7 = 68
+7.5 = 83
+9 = 77

Sami is surfing the greens nicely today. I still need to go read the protocol again, but I wanted to put this question out there to give everyone time to add their input.

My question is what I should do if Sami continues to surf through PMPS. On 1/25/10 I shot a full 1.5 unit dose at 167, but the way things have been going the last few days being over 300 at PMPS and going down into the mid to low 100's at night. I am just concerned that she might go too low, but I am not sure exactly how this works, maybe she won’t.

I have lots of strips and HC food available so that doesn't worry me. What I am worried about is sending her too low and having her rebound tomorrow after she had such a great day.

I know you probably can't give too much advice without seeing her PMPS number but maybe you can give me a "what if" scenario.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

Now she is 69 at +10.

Recap:
AMPS = 215
+2.5 = 191
+4.5 = 127
+6 = 96
+7 = 68
+7.5 = 83
+9 = 77
+10=69
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

Looks like a beuteous surf to me....just remains to be seen what her PMPS number will be. Remember, she has to go down even further to get a dose reduction....and what better time than when you are with her, either at home or at work? :mrgreen:

Questions: When she was (or still is for that matter) low, did she go and eat on her own? It's good if they do...feed themselves to bring the BG up. Also, are you giving her low carb or higher carb to feed the lower numbers?

You're right...no one's going to want to give dose advice without seeing where she's at at PMPS as well as your comfort level at that time....just the nature of the beasties here! :YMHUG:
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

Interesting day for you and Sami as well.
Today was my one and only day of experience below 100 so I waon't comment at all.
You will get the proper guidance and you have a good idea what to do for Sami as well.
When is +11? Intersting that she is still coming down at +10. See about that +11.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

Hi, hello... Sami seems to do nice on 1.5... Spacey also was higher in the evening than in the mornings. I have never figured that one out. But somehow now she seems stable during the whole day.
So, I'm afraid I can't advice on anything. Wish you both the best though. ;-)
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

What a beautiful cycle for Sami! It's awesome that you can take her to the office with you!
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

Hi Tina. Right now this cycle is just so darn PRETTY!! This is exactly what you want to see. I know you are getting nervous about the dose and what the BG will be. Brenda is correct in that Sami didn't get low enough for a reduction, but depending on what the +12 looks like, you may want to stall the shot to allow the numbers to rise to a comfortable level. Can't predict just yet, but that would be my first recommendation... stall.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

The other issue is that you are not going to be able to control whether or not Sami rebounds. (Geez, if we only could. You've seen a bit of what Gabby can do!) Bounces are all part of liver training school (LTS) and some kitties catch on quickly and some, well, not so much! (Gabby being in the latter group.) I wouldn't worry about whether a trip to rebound city (RBC) is going to occur and how to tweek the dose now to address that. You really can't effectively tweek the dose anyway without there being consequences that will give you bigger headaches in the long run. Right now, you have to wait to see where Sami is at when PMPS rolls around. If you need to stall, do notfeed!. Stall for 15 min. and retest. You may need to repeat this for a bit. You do not want to shoot if it's a dropping number. At this point, I don't believe you have the data to shoot this low of a number, either. Your best course of action is to stall, like CD suggested.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

Brenda and Morris said:
Looks like a beuteous surf to me....just remains to be seen what her PMPS number will be. Remember, she has to go down even further to get a dose reduction....and what better time than when you are with her, either at home or at work? :mrgreen:

Questions: When she was (or still is for that matter) low, did she go and eat on her own? It's good if they do...feed themselves to bring the BG up. Also, are you giving her low carb or higher carb to feed the lower numbers?

You're right...no one's going to want to give dose advice without seeing where she's at at PMPS as well as your comfort level at that time....just the nature of the beasties here! :YMHUG:
Click to expand...

Brenda,

Yes, she eat on her own at +7 when she was 68. At +10 when she was 69 I just put the food in front of her and she ate again on her own. But I don't know if her desire to eat was stimulated by my testing her, and I don't know if she would have eaten on her own if had she been sleeping. During both of these times she ate her low carb food that is always out. I figured if she went lower I could always give the HC but she came up slightly with the LC so I was happy with that.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

Sienne and Gabby said:
The other issue is that you are not going to be able to control whether or not Sami rebounds. (Geez, if we only could. You've seen a bit of what Gabby can do!) Bounces are all part of liver training school (LTS) and some kitties catch on quickly and some, well, not so much! (Gabby being in the latter group.) I wouldn't worry about whether a trip to rebound city (RBC) is going to occur and how to tweek the dose now to address that. You really can't effectively tweek the dose anyway without there being consequences that will give you bigger headaches in the long run. Right now, you have to wait to see where Sami is at when PMPS rolls around. If you need to stall, do notfeed!. Stall for 15 min. and retest. You may need to repeat this for a bit. You do not want to shoot if it's a dropping number. At this point, I don't believe you have the data to shoot this low of a number, either. Your best course of action is to stall, like CD suggested.
Click to expand...

I would like to stall if I could, but the problem is that I would like to move her shot time from current 6:30 to 5:15. So delaying wouldn't be so good because then it would push me back further. But if that is what I need to do then it will have to be.

Please note that at +11 Sami was 86, but this was after a short car ride home. I will test her again in 30 minutes just before her shot time. I guess I will have to wait to see where she is at that point. If she is still rising after being home for more than an hours then I think I would be okay to shot the full dose, as long as she is over 100. Then I will just need to be ready to test heavy tonight. But if she is the same or lower I just don't know. I just can't see shoting under 100.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

I agree! take the stall!!!

let's wait it out and see where she is at +12 ok?
chill and have some chocolates! u have chocolates in ur Tool Kit right? :-D
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

Recap:
AMPS = 215
+2.5 = 191
+4.5 = 127
+6 = 96
+7 = 68
+7.5 = 83
+9 = 77
+10=69
+11=86
PMPS=77

Okay here is where we are. 77 at PMPS. Her shot is due in under 5 minutes and I definitely don't feel comfortable shoting at this BG.

Based on Tilly's I have three options. And probably none of them will produce exactly what I want.

"It is likely, because of the way Lantus and Levemir work (they appear to work for >12 hours, therefore producing overlap between doses), you will face the problem of having a low pre-shot BG and wondering what dose you should give. Try reducing the dose the first few times to see what happens - in all likelihood the cat will have higher BGs as a result. A second alternative is to feed the cat, wait 1 to 2 hours, test again, and when the BGs start rising, give the normal dose. A third alternative is to split the dose: feed the cat, give most of the dose immediately and give the remainder 1 to 2 hours later when the BGs start rising. However, in most cats none of these alternatives have shown themselves to work as well as consistent dosing. You will have to learn how your cat reacts to Lantus/Levemir before you determine the best way to deal with this problem."

What it says here is to reduce the dose the first few times to see how the cat reacts, which could produce higher BG by the next shot time. This is the one that I am leaning toward since I really don't want to have to delay the shot if I really don't have to.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

Sienne: If you need to stall, do notfeed!. Stall for 15 min. and retest. You may need to repeat this for a bit. You do not want to shoot if it's a dropping number. At this point, I don't believe you have the data to shoot this low of a number, either. Your best course of action is to stall, like CD suggested.
Click to expand...


can u stall and test in 15 minutes? do not feed yet.




please edit ur subject line so we can see ur PMPS number
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - AMPS 215; NEED DOSE ADVICE +10=69

Can you do just a 15 minute delay like Ronnie suggested? It won't make a difference for your morning shot.

If Sami is still too low to shoot comfortably, then back off on the dose a little bit. You probably won't lose too much momentum and you will get it back. But she sure had beautiful numbers today!
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - PMPS 77; +1 98

The one night it is of the utmost importance that Sami eat dinner and she didn't show much interest in any of the different varieties that I I put out for her. I was really starting to get worried, but then I started to make the cat food popsicles and that changed everything. Just like a little kid, Sami was up on the counter waiting to lick the spoon and the bowl. After 4 cans of food and two trays of cat food popsicles Sami ate at least 4 tablespoons of food. Thank goodness.

All of my cats seem to love the cat food popsicles. I put out 2-3 in any empty dish when I get up to do Sami's midnight test. Then by 2 am the food thaws enough and the cats can eat it. Really quite funny, but I am glad they can have a little snack in the middle of the night. Although it doesn't always keep them from waking me up in the morning.

At +1 Sami is up to 98, but I know this rise is primarily food based. I will be checking her again at +2, which is in about 30 minutes.

Hope tonight goes well.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - PMPS 77; +1 98; +1.5; 87

Libby and Lucy said:
did you shoot?
Click to expand...

Yep, sorry about that. I shot a 1.25 at 6:15 pm, which is a 15 minute move from 6:30 shot time this morning. Depending on what happens over night and her AMPS I will determine if I will shot 1.5 or 1.25 in the morning. Since it seems most cats go lower at night I will probably go ahead and shot the 1.5 tomorrow morning as long as she isn't under 100. If she is under 100 or maybe as high as 125 I will probably shot 1.25 and see how it goes.

So far so good tonight. I just put the rest of Sami's dinner in front of her and she is chowing down. Hopefully the food will stabilize her a bit. but I plan to check her again in a few minutes at +2. More than likely she will have gone up because of the food. I will continue to check every 30 minutes to 1 hour until I see that she isn't going lower, but I really don't know where that stops. I guess I will have to wait and see.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - PMPS 77

ChrisH said:
More (almost) full moon madness here! Looking at your SS, it looks like you shot the full dose.
Click to expand...


Opps, I forgot to update the speadsheet. I actually shot 1.25. Hopefully it won't backfire.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - PMPS 77; +1 98; +2 78

Sami is still droping slowly. I am checking her about every 30 minutes right now, and I am ready for for a hypo event, but I sure hope we don't have one tonight. I am hoping she surfs the greens all night.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - PMPS 77

Tina:

For future reference, if you have a PS number you are uncomfortable with, you have three options. First, you can stall. Do not feed. Wait 15 min. and re-test. You may need to repeat this several times. You don't want to shoot a dropping number. Once your cat starts to surf or the number is rising appreciably, you can shoot. Remember, though, that a late shot is like a dose decrease. The second option is to shoot a BCS (big chicken sh*t) dose. This is like what you did tonight. Sometimes you may need to reduce the dose even more than what you did like if you had to leave the house and wouldn't be back for several hours. The reduced dose obviously has an effect on the shed. You want to try to not stall for a long time (more than 30 - 45 min) and shoot a reduced dose. This has double the effect on the shed. Finally, you could skip the shot. This last option is, well, the last option since it has the most effect on the shed. Sometimes, though, it is the only and/or best option.

I'd urge you to not make generalizations like most cats go lower overnight. In many cases that may be true. It may, in fact be generally true for Sami. The question is more will it be true for Sami tonight? Likewise, don't fix a "no shoot" number in your head. The mantra here is "shoot low to stay low." And the corollary is "shoot low to stay low once you have the data." If you get your brain fixed on a number, once you have the data and can shoot low, it will be even harder to do so. I'd encourage you to view every situation as an opportunity to look at what you know about Sami and what will be the best option at that time.

As far as a "hypo" event, I've yet to see one here. A hypo is only when a cat is symptomatic. If you are testing and alert to what Sami is telling you, you will be in control of lower numbers. Remember, even with Baby's overdose, she was asymptomatic. Nicole and several people here were up all night but Baby never experienced symptoms of hypoglycemia. Sami may have low numbers but that's all they are if you keep doing exactly what you have been doing.
 
Re: 1/28 Sami - PMPS 77

Sienne and Gabby said:
Tina:

For future reference, if you have a PS number you are uncomfortable with, you have three options. First, you can stall. Do not feed. Wait 15 min. and re-test. You may need to repeat this several times. You don't want to shoot a dropping number. Once your cat starts to surf or the number is rising appreciably, you can shoot. Remember, though, that a late shot is like a dose decrease. The second option is to shoot a BCS (big chicken sh*t) dose. This is like what you did tonight. Sometimes you may need to reduce the dose even more than what you did like if you had to leave the house and wouldn't be back for several hours. The reduced dose obviously has an effect on the shed. You want to try to not stall for a long time (more than 30 - 45 min) and shoot a reduced dose. This has double the effect on the shed. Finally, you could skip the shot. This last option is, well, the last option since it has the most effect on the shed. Sometimes, though, it is the only and/or best option.

I'd urge you to not make generalizations like most cats go lower overnight. In many cases that may be true. It may, in fact be generally true for Sami. The question is more will it be true for Sami tonight? Likewise, don't fix a "no shoot" number in your head. The mantra here is "shoot low to stay low." And the corollary is "shoot low to stay low once you have the data." If you get your brain fixed on a number, once you have the data and can shoot low, it will be even harder to do so. I'd encourage you to view every situation as an opportunity to look at what you know about Sami and what will be the best option at that time.

As far as a "hypo" event, I've yet to see one here. A hypo is only when a cat is symptomatic. If you are testing and alert to what Sami is telling you, you will be in control of lower numbers. Remember, even with Baby's overdose, she was asymptomatic. Nicole and several people here were up all night but Baby never experienced symptoms of hypoglycemia. Sami may have low numbers but that's all they are if you keep doing exactly what you have been doing.
Click to expand...

Sienne,

I did read the Tilly's Protocol before I decided what to do. As you can see in this excerpt from the website, I did what they recommend to try first.

"It is likely, because of the way Lantus and Levemir work (they appear to work for >12 hours, therefore producing overlap between doses), you will face the problem of having a low pre-shot BG and wondering what dose you should give. Try reducing the dose the first few times to see what happens - in all likelihood the cat will have higher BGs as a result. A second alternative is to feed the cat, wait 1 to 2 hours, test again, and when the BGs start rising, give the normal dose. A third alternative is to split the dose: feed the cat, give most of the dose immediately and give the remainder 1 to 2 hours later when the BGs start rising. However, in most cats none of these alternatives have shown themselves to work as well as consistent dosing. You will have to learn how your cat reacts to Lantus/Levemir before you determine the best way to deal with this problem."

I knew I had the option to stall, but the fact that I am trying to change her shot time didn't really allow for that today, so I took a gamble and lowered the dose by .25 and shot 15 minute earlier than her last shot. For me I thought this was the best option. Tomorrow I am not so sure, but I will deal with it when I get there.

As you can see from my post I did say most cats go lower at night, not all cats but a lot of the ss I look at show lower numbers over night than during the day. I don't know what causes this to happen, but it is still a fact that needs to be considered, whether it is Sami that is going lower at night or another cat. I still like to know what can happen. That is what looking at the spreadsheets is all about, understanding what each cat does. I feel that watching other spreadsheets and seeing what others are going through will help me to make the best decisions possible. I understand that all cats are different but it still helps to look at those other spreadsheets.

I am not exactly sure what you mean by fixing a "no shot" number in my head. If you are talking about my comment about whether I will shot 1.5 units in the morning or 1.25 depending on her AMPS, then I will tell you that it helps me to think these things through before they happen. In life in general I am a planner and if I have a plan for every situation then I am more likely to keep a level head when the decision time comes upon me. I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't want to get to shot time and not have a plan in mind, because if I have to take time to research or re-read the protocol then I might end up delaying shot time, and right now that is not what I want to do. I would rather have an idea in my mind ahead of time. Not that I am going to go with the idea, but at least I have given it some thought ahead of time.

I never said Sami was having a Hypoglycemic episode. I only said I was read for one if it should happen. And if I were going on symptoms alone I would have already been pumping Sami with HC food, because she has been somewhat dazed all night. I will continue to watch her numbers and if she dips below 50 I will be giving MC or HC food. I will not be waiting for symptoms to show up, because as I stated before I know what it feels like to have low blood sugar and I don't just mean symptomatically, I mean LOW BLOOD SUGAR. I know a lot of people have symptoms of low blood sugar and think they might be hypoglycemic, but those symptoms are just the signs that the blood sugar is approaching a danger zone. They are meant to alert you that you need to get food in your system soon. I have these symptoms almost every single day of my life and on occasion I test my sugar just to see exactly where I am when this happen. Most of the time I am in the low 70's, but if I don't eat something soon I will be dipping into the 60's before too long. Before I really understood hypoglycemia I didn't pay attention to these symptoms, and there were at least two occasions that I did fall below 60 and it is a very scary feeling. Now I eat at least every 2-3 hours and I pay close attention to the signs my sugar is dropping.
 
Sami is surfing nicely. At +3 she is at 78. I have offered her food a few times over the last three hours and she has eaten each time. I think this is what is helping to keep her level. I have not been feeding HC only her LC diet, and so far it seems to be working. I will test one more time at +4 before I try to get some sleep, but I will probably set the alarm for 11 pm to get a +5 and 12 am to get a +6 reading. Based on what I see for these readings will determine how often I continue to take reading. I hope she just surfs through the night in the 70's and 80's. Wouldn't that be so nice.

We will see how it goes. Talk to you all in the morning.

Nighty, Night.
 
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