1/11 Fitzel - UPDATE WITH THANK YOUS!

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Shai and The Pirate Fitz (GA)

Member Since 2012
Using my iPhone and I can't get it to copy my previous condo URL.

Recap - 1/9 - PMPS 398

1/10. - AMPS - 435
PMPS - 476
1/11 - AMPS - 422

She hasn't been in the 400's since she was diagnosed last year. She's been in the 300's of late with a dosage of .25 which is 2 drops. When I bumped her to 3 drops she crashes down to the 40's and 30's.

We started the disaster of assisted feeding on the 9th and the stress this puts on both of us is through the roof. My beloved Pirate has to be restrained by my practically sitting on her. We still end up wearing more of the slush on us than in her. Then she hides under one of our bookcases until I have to drag her out for testing - which she hates. Then shoot insulin and B12. Give her bupe. Give her A/B's. Then drag her out again a few hours later to force feed her again.

Her numbers terrify me. The only good news at the moment are no ketones but if I can't stabalize her I'm sure that will change. Do I increase her insulin and let her crash? I'm stuck in bed for the most part because of my own health and its all I can to to get up to do the meds and forced feeding. I can't do more tests as my energy is exhausted with the above tasks for Fitzel and the medical proceedures I have to do daily for myself.

Does anyone have any ideas? I do want to thank you Liz for the link to the assisted feeding group. I did join but the site is confusing to me and I think it's harder to navigate with a phone. I don't have the energy to get to our computer. But I'm very greatful to know they are there.

Shai
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

((((Shai)))) I thought the FAF site was confusing too but the video is excellent. That is really all I looked at. Do you wrap Fitzel in a sheet or towel? I put a sheet around Zener and then spread a sheet on a table. He was pretty docile about it though. You may have to make a kitty burrito out of Fitzel. She is a tough girl.
Liz

ETA: Here is yesterday's condo.
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Hi Shai,

I'm sorry not to have any suggestions, but want to send both you and Fitzel good thoughts and healing vines.

Hang in there!

Ella & Rusty
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Fitzel condo from 1/10 Here's your last condo.
I can only send you many hugs & prayers for you both. I'm sure those who know will be with you and have good advice. xoxo mary and oliver
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Hi Liz - Fitzel won't allow the burrito. She uses her back legs to 'eviserate' me and shred the towel until she's foamy. Unfortunately I'm doing this alone and I can't seem to keep her in the blanket and wield the syringe.

I have to get a different syringe. The one the vet gave me sticks and the slush comes out in spurts. I don't know where to buy them except online which is hard for us as we don't use PayPal. It would be better if a petshop like Petco sold them but they don't seem to.

I wish I could get Zenner to talk with Fitz and pass along pointers.
Shai
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

ecurie - thank you for posting my previous condo and for your healing vines and thoughts. We need them.

Ella - thank you for your heartfelt vines and support.

We really need this right now. I'm just laying here in a very quiet house knowing I'm going to have to force feed soon it makes me sick to my stomach.
Shai
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Hi Shai. I don't really have any advice, either, but I wanted to say how sorry I am that you and Fitzel are having to go thru this. Fortunately for me, Muffin is pretty docile for all her treatments, like Zener. I do have another one, tho, who is just like Fitz, I can hardly do anything to him, so I really understand what you're going thru. All the advice I can give is for you to try and remain as calm as possible. I'm sure you dread the times you have to do these things, but try not to think about it. Fitz can sense that. I hope things get better.
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Did you cut the tip off of the syringe to make the opening bigger? Did you puree the food so there aren't any chunks at all? It could be that a chunk is getting stuck. Maybe a bigger towel so that you get her rear legs too?
Liz

We have 10 ml syringes.
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Anne - thank you for your support. I'm glad to hear that Muffin allows you to help her. It's so hard when they don't and we can't tell them why we're doing what were doing.

Liz - the syringe I have has a nice big opening and I purée the food in a bullet blender. The plunger is what's sticking. I've tried oiling it but one of the things from the assisted feeding group that I did find out is that the monoject syringe is k own to stick. Makes me wonder why vets offer them.

I tried burritoing Fitz with a bath towel. She's just stronger than I am. Doesn't say much for me.
Shai
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Many hugs and vines - I know first hand how horrible and exhausting assist feeding can be with an unwilling cat. Have you discussed the possibility of a feeding tube with your vet? Or have you tried one in the past? In the best case they're supposed to make feeding much less unpleasant, plus you can give medications through the tube too.
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Well, drat. I was hoping it would be something easy but you're totally on top of it. Do you think Fitzel would tolerate the feeding tube? Maybe that is a ridiculous question...
Liz
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

I'm sorry to hear how hard this all is becoming. My only offering of ideas is to use a squeeze bottle rather than the syringe, like a ketchup bottle. It may be a little easier to use one handed. I use a small one to give Tess extra water after a pill rather than a syringe.
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

I'm wondering if you saw Jill's post about introducing the pancreatic enzymes in a smaller amount.

Also, please take a look at the link to this vet clinic site that discusses treatment of EPI. Apparently, a gelatin capsule will work; enteric coated tablets will not. They mention contacting a compounding pharmacy.
MarvistaVet said:
Dietary supplementation with digestive enzymes is an effective therapy for EPI even though most of the supplement given is digested in the stomach along with other dietary proteins. The little bit that survives the acid bath of the stomach and the patient’s own protein-digesting chemicals turns out to be enough to stop the diarrhea and enable the patient to actually gain some weight. Powdered enzymes (Viokase-V, Pancrezyme) seem to work the best; tablets are available but do not seem to break down consistently. If the pet finds the taste of the enzymes objectionable, a compounding pharmacy can fill gel capsules with the powder. Again, enteric-coated tablets simply do not seem to work well.

In the past, it was suggested thatincubating the enzymes in the patient’s food would help initiate the digestion process in the food bowl but this has not been found to be true; the enzymes can be fed immediately mixed with the patient’s regular pet food. Some patients respond best when an H2 blocker-type antacid (such as famotidine) is given concurrently with the enzymes.
Click to expand...

The information on the above quoted page is from 2011 so it's pretty recent. I'd talk to your vet about this. I suspect that the bottom line is that if getting the enzymes compounded will get them into Fitz with the least amount of stress for your both and it works, it's a win-win.
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

((Shai)) so sorry for what you are going through. I have no advice just hugs and prayers for what you are going through. I pray things will get easier for you and Fitzel. The 400 numbers do stink maybe adding one drop would help? Take care and you have my number and email if you need to chat or need help.
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

((hugs)) Just keeping you guys in our thoughts .. I know it is not easy .. Just hang in there ...
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

I've been through the same, are you sure she's not sick ? having diarrhea maybe.. My Noni is doing that because she's sick and having diarrhea too. FAF very good. she stopped eating and I had to syringe feed her for a while .. it helped getting her back into food. she eats just fine now .

I feed every 2 hours because she lost lot of weight . and giving high calories too.

wishing you luck with the syringe feeding, I know how stressful for both of you. but did you see the video @ FAF they lady that is syringe feeding. you have to be less stressed so Fitzel can relax too while feeding.

Aseel & Noni
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

I agree that a squeeze bottle might help make it easier to control. A beauty supply store or CVS/Walgreens should carry empty squeeze bottles (for hair color). Syringes, especially the larger ones, tend to get stuck. When I had to syringe liquified food, I used multiple smaller syringes instead of the really big ones. They're easier to handle. Or maybe try a cake decorating bag. Presumably you can make your own out of a Ziploc bag.

I pray that Fitzel calms down and lets you help her...

MJ
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

I'm sorry Shai - I Wish I had some suggestions.... I will instead send healing vines, positive thoughts, and wish you guys the best. Hugs to all!
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Hi Shai, I am so sorry for what you & Fitzel are going through!! I do know how you feel as I have had to syringe feed Moonie many times & it is so hard..I syringe lactulose into her mouth 3X a day now & it's always a battle!!I hold her head & put syringe near her mouth..Being that she only has about 5 teeth, I slip it in there and as she struggles, I always get it in somehow when she finally opens, and she pushes it away with her paw!! But I usually win!
Every time is a battle of wills!--And of course I have to keep her from hurting herself!
I have a rather large syringe the vet gave me, but you got some good ideas today--
You are doing a great job..In spite of all the odds, Fitzel is doing OK & that is because of you!
Sending Healing Vines to you both, along with some Hugs from us~~
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Hi Shai, I am so sorry for what you & Fitzel are going through!! I do know how you feel as I have had to syringe feed Moonie many times & it is so hard..I syringe lactulose into her mouth 3X a day now & it's always a battle!!I hold her head & put syringe near her mouth..Being that she only has about 5 teeth, I slip it in there and as she struggles, I always get it in somehow when she finally opens, and she pushes it away with her paw!! But I usually win!
Every time is a battle of wills!--And of course I have to keep her from hurting herself!
I have a rather large syringe the vet gave me, but you got some good ideas today--
You are doing a great job..In spite of all the odds, Fitzel is doing OK & that is because of you!
Sending Healing Vines to you both, along with some Hugs from us~~
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Hi Shai, I am so sorry for what you & Fitzel are going through!! I do know how you feel as I have had to syringe feed Moonie many times & it is so hard..I syringe lactulose into her mouth 3X a day now & it's always a battle!!I hold her head & put syringe near her mouth..Being that she only has about 5 teeth, I slip it in there and as she struggles, I always get it in somehow when she finally opens, and she pushes it away with her paw!! But I usually win!
Every time is a battle of wills!--And of course I have to keep her from hurting herself!
I have a rather large syringe the vet gave me, but you got some good ideas today--
You are doing a great job..In spite of all the odds, Fitzel is doing OK & that is because of you!
Sending Healing Vines to you both, along with some Hugs from us~~
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

I just took a quick photo of the syringe I use. I added a short length of silicone tubing on the end that allows me to gently sneak it into the side of the mouth, and it doesn't hurt if kitty bites down on it. I stole - I mean borrowed - this from work, but I think you can find aquarium tubing that is similar. Or I'd be happy to send some to whoever needs it.

syringe.jpg


MJ
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Shai

I know you don't want to do the feeding tube but it really is something to consider. The cats do really well with the etube. It can be short term until you are able to get the EPI and IBD under control and it wouldn't be such a fight for you both. You can put certain meds in it...you'd have to check with your vet which ones. It isn't cruel and it isn't painful.

Sending you many, many prayers for you and your girl.
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

So sorry that both of you are going through this. I think you are doing great, hang in there.
To share my experience on the force feeding with syringes;
1) Be prepared with a few small syringes with the blended food instead of using one large syringe which is more prone to stuck. Take your time with feeding & stay calm. Dont drag Fitzel when he is really upset. The dragging part will annoy him more thus making the feeding difficult.
2) If Fitzel is more accomodating to the test & shoot, do that first. Then force feed. The less you drag him out from closet, under bed will be less stress for you both. Try restricting him to small area where it's easier for you to access him helps too.
3) Try blending different kind of canned food to try. Maybe Frizel is not happy with his usual food? It's always easier if he eats on his own.

We all relate to that feeling of frustration Shai. When a cat refuse food, it's difficult. As long as he swallows, there is hope things will improve. :YMHUG:
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help

Hi Shai,
I don't stop in here very often these days. Today I did and your post grabbed my attention. First, I am really sorry to hear about your difficulties with syringe feeding. Forgive me if I say anything that has already been said or seems irrelevant. I have not looked back at yours or Fitzel's history.

I syringe fed my latte for about 9 months or so. The last 9 -10 months of her life, I syringed on/off. There were a lot of trials and errors before we got it down as a routine. I'm not sure what syringes you are using, but often times the ones you get from the vet do not work very well after a few feedings. The little rubber part wears out. That is why you get the jerky movements when pushing the syringe. I remember that frustration all too well.

There are two syringes I found worked best. My favorite was given to me each time I bought lactulose from my vet. I looked them up online tonight and believe they are PE Oral Syringes.
9300-01LRG.jpg
The nice thing about these is that there is no rubber stopper to wear down. I cant seem to find where you can buy these online unless in bulk ($$$$). Maybe ask your vet if they have any of these on hand? Could you email a picture? I will look in Latte's supply box and see if I have any left. I know I gave some away. If I have more than 1, I would be happy to send it your way. They were like gold to me in her last 1.5yrs.

The other syringe, I believe was a baxa. Unfortunately I cannot find it in a google search. I thought I had it bookmarked. I can look some more. Again, I will check in Latte's supplies and see what I may have left. These DO have rubber stoppers, but they do not wear out easily. I wish I could remember where I got them?!?!

Is there a condo where you talked about how you syringe feed? Where do you sit? Where does Fitzel sit? What is the process? Maybe if you could share some of that, others could suggest ways to tweak it and make it less stressful for both of you. I remember when I had to learn to give fluids. OMG! Latte would have NONE of it (from me). Eventually it dawned on me. Anytime we were at the vet and she was scared, I could hold her and she would put her head in my arm. Well, fluids were scary...even at home. So instead of sitting her on a table, I would hold her on my lap and let her hide in my arm. We managed fluids this way for 3.5yrs w/o a problem (once I figured it out). Sometimes its just a matter of figuring out what will work best for Fitzel's (and your) personality. Oh- and Latte eventually stopped hiding her head. Fluids became part of life vs a scary event.

Fitzel the pirate? Is Fitzel a one eyed kitty? My current foster is a pirate, too! :mrgreen:

hang in there!

ETA: After looking back at some posts, it looks as if you are not treating the IBD. Is there a reason for that? Latte had IBD. I would be happy to offer some suggestions, if you have not been given some already.
 
Re: 1/11 Fitzel - We Need Help/ UPDATE THANK YOUS!

OMG - I haven't been on the board for a few days and I'm in overwhelm of gratitude re: all the heartfelt and informative responses to our situation.

THANK YOU ALL SO VERY MUCH. YOU ARE ANGELS SENT TO MY PIRATE FROM HEAVEN​

I need a bit of time to go through all of your posts thoughtfully - I'm in tears of gratitude. There are pics to look at, pin point suggestions re: syringe options.

She is doing a bit better having the enzymes (what I can actually get into her and not wear :shock: ). Her coat is getting glossy and losing that greased up look. She's not constantly crying because even though she ate, she's still hungry. And her weight has stabalized - perhaps even gained a bit.

In spite of all we're going through, after reading all these posts I know my beloved Pirate and I are SO BLESSED!!!

Shai and The Pirate Fitz
 
Hi Shai and Fitzel,

We are encouraged that Fitzel is improving. Continuing to send healing vines. You sure got a lot of good information from the beans here.

Keeping you and Fitz in our thoughts and prayers,

Ella & Rusty
 
I talked to Shai yesterday and just wanted to let everyone know that although fitzel has been fighting forced feedings she is now occasionally accepting them and feeling sooo much better-the enzymes appear to be helping immensely as she was bathing herself in the rays of the sunshine- of which she hasn't done for the past 6 months or so..which is wonderful news!!!

Still sending much love and healing vines to Shai & Fitzel

(hugs)
Fitzels offical god mommie :)
 
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