06/01 J.D. PMPS 198, +2.5 213 - I gave fluids!

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Dyana

Dyana

Member Since 2009
Yesterday's long Condo

Last Night:
308 PMPS
366 +3
531 +9 (TOR)
312 +11

When I woke up with J.D. laying across my face at 3:00am, I got him up to test, and noticed that five of the six food bowls were licked clean. I wasn't sure if I should give buprenex or R. I finally chose the R and gave him at the zero line which brought him down the 200 points. Maybe a little too fast, but at 3:00am I couldn't measure less than at the zero line. I made sure he ate his 1st Breffis before I shot his Levemir.
One thing that I do notice is that since the fluids were given to him yesterday at the vet, he has been drinking a lot less water. He didn't even drink water after eating this morning. I think he needed those fluids.


THANK YOU EVERYONE for your words of support and advice yesterday on all this. I'm sorry it didn't all have to do with diabetes, but I knew I could trust what you guys tell me, so reached out to my knowledgable friends here in LLand. :YMHUG:

Wishing the best for the blood test results, today.

Tomorrow, I'll tell my regular vet that I would really like to have J.D.'s blood pressure tested...if I keep the appointment.

Hugs to you all.

I hope everyone has a good Friday.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

Good job licking those plates clean JD!!!! I'm so happy you're feeling better enough to eat:) Sounds like those fluids are doing their job and I hope he continues to get stronger with every mouthful he eats.

Sending more healing vines to you JD and hugs for you Dyana.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

Glad to see that J.D. is eating well and wow on having to measure such a small amount at early hour! Also happy to hear the fluids have helped. I give Cleo fluids daily and it has really made the difference in her QOL. I could really tell a big difference after the first time I gave them to her. She used to just hang out at the water bowl all day. Now she drinks a normal amount and has more energy.

Hoping and praying for good bloodwork results today.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

Hi guys .. I guess I did not catch up on the vet visit yesterday but I'm glad to hear J.D. got some much needed fluids and drank less at home for you .. I'm glad the R brought him back down a good amount .. those 500 are scary .. this morning's amps is very nice .. hope you guys have a great weekend!
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

Five of the six bowls wiped clean???? :lol: :lol: :lol:

I hear in the USA you can get prescription food from petsmart with a prescription from the vet. Do you know if you can get maxcal there?

I think ondansetron is worth its weight in gold (or a much more precious metal LOL). I'm sure the fluids helped also.

I'm glad there are so many people here with the depth of knowledge they do and are so willing to share. When people post about these things, people following along are informed also and may help them one day. Opening their mind and heart to doing fluids at home for example or assist feeding. Diabetes isn't just about the BG number - we know that DKA is a combo of factors.

Give J.D. a belly rub from me.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

It sounds like J.D. is feeling better. That's a good way to start your day!

(Sleeping across your face? Really? J.D.!!!)
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

Good report on J.D. and his appy. Hoping for good test results today. J.D., that's a unique way to wake up the Bean! Don't give Maggie any ideas about the sleeping on face, though! :lol: Hope you had some sleep.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

Are you starting to give the sub-q to JD soon? Is not as difficult as it seems, a lot of my friends with renal cats are doing it once or twice everyday.
Glad that JD is having his appy back.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

I may give fluids tonight. I'll check in with you all later, to see if you think I should.

Right now, I am sitting here at work with fingers crossed and waiting waiting waiting for a phone call from the vet.

Please keep wishing us good results.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

Great news the JD is feeling better! It is amazing how much fluids can help. Hope you have a great day Dyana!!
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

as long as there is no heart disease, a little fluids will not hurt. somewhere between 50-100cc should be fine. would probably start with 50
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

Glad to hear that J.D. is eating. Waiting to hear the news from the vet. My thoughts are with you Dyana.

pattie
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. AMPS 314

Did he have to sleep across your face???? ohmygod_smile He is so funny!!!!
Glad he is feeling better...whew....giant sigh of relief from me...
Hope you get good blood work results....paws crossed...
Hugs to you both and one for Ginger too.... :YMHUG: :YMHUG: :YMHUG:
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198 some BW results

J.D. is outside, and so I have to watch him. We just came back from a little walk.

I don't have the printout of the results, yet, but per Dr. B; his RBC is Good, his WBC is Good, his Liver is Good.. I said "his liver is good" and he said his Liver is Great and I said "his liver is good", his BUN was 67 which is high and his last BUN was 49 and his Creatinine is 2.2 which is "high-normal" (0.8 - 2.3) which he said could be elivated by the diabetes and dehydration, but still.. his PHO 4.7 which he said was "fantastic", oh and his glucose was 368 (Akray Vital 341 before we left the house). So all in all a good report. I asked about his weight for his build and age, and he was it was really good and that I am doing a good job. Lots of goods.

I told him that J.D. was drinking like normal last night and not drinking constantly like before, and he said to give him fluids again tonight.. he said 100ml because of his build. Is that okay? Oh, boy, this is going to be my first time trying this... all by myself, on my own cat. I'm going to wait a bit, and check out some videos first.

We have steak athawing, in order to celebrate.

Okay, back outside I go..
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198 some BW results

Good luck with the fluids tonight. I know how terrifying it is the first time. 100 ml is what I give Cleo. She is about 12 1/2 pounds but I'm not sure it has anything to do with weight, just how much fluids they need. I think 100 is about what most people give. I play quiet music in the background when I am giving Cleo her fluids and stroke her head. It really keeps her calm. And it keeps me calm. The more calm I am, the better it goes.

Glad the BW results look good.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198 some BW results

you will do fine. do not panic if you do not get the whole hundred in. do what you can and can try again later or tomorrow. it gets easier.
twink has gotten up and pulled out needle and fluid squirting everywhere but I am fast and can stick that sucker right back in and finish. that is the only time I stick twice with same needle
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198 some BW results

I'm glad to hear that J.D. has eaten well today, and that he is drinking less. I think that the fluids he received yesterday probably helped him feel better. I would give them again today.

The phosphorus looks good, so you don't have to worry about giving a phosphorus binder. The BUN (which can be affected by dehydration) and slightly elevated creatinine may be contributing to his feeling off. The dehydration could contribute to that as well. Given these results, and his USG yesterday of 1.024, he is likely in early stages of chronic kidney disease. This is entirely expected in a cat his age, and is not a sign that anything terrible is about to happen. You will just go forward as you have been, and manage his symptoms.

I really suggest that you start browsing through Tanya's CRF website. It is a huge site with tons of info, and you just take little bits of it at a time.

There is a section there about diet. Feeding a diet of a good quality protein food which is lower in phosphorus can be helpful. The most critical thing in a CKD kitty is first of all keeping him eating. I wouldn't mess around with diet until J.D. is feeling 100% again, and even then, I am not sure that he needs any changes right now. You are balancing diabetes, pancreatitis, and inappetance, so I would not try to make any big changes at the moment. Just keep it in mind for future reference. Right now, you have your hands full learning about the sub Q fluids, and getting J.D. back to feeling better. Keeping him eating is the best thing you can do.

I think it would be good to get his BP checked now to get a baseline, and keep an eye on it in the future.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198 some BW results

I think those numbers are really good considering his age! Nice!!!!

So just a few tips on the fluids....I keep my needles in the freezer...it dulls the sting as the needle goes in. Just like an insulin syringe, insert the needle with the bevel up. I usually warm fluids just a bit....I have an infrared thermometer that can read the temp of the fluids in the bag but if you just run a little bit on your arm and make sure it's not too hot.

I'm happy to help in any way I can so let me know if you have questions.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198 some BW results

Okay.. I gave him some fluids. I did not warm them.
My vet said the 1 line was the zero line, and that we gave him from the 1 line to the 2 line yesterday, and that I should go to the 3 line tonight.
Well, when I examined the bag, it looked more like the fluid was close to the 1 line but not quite there. The bag is all thin at the top when you hang it up, so I don't know how that affects things.

Anyway, it took like 2 minutes or less, and now the bag is reading at around the 2.5 line, so I may have given him more than 100ml? He has a camel hump behind his neck.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198 some BW results

Well done! You are very brave. I didn't know you should insert the needle with beveled side up either. Why is that?
Liz
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198 some BW results

That's fine. Good job! I found it very hard to see exactly where the fluid line was. After a while, I went more by how long it took (Emily would let me know when we were done) or by the size of the lump, and got a ball park idea from line on the bag.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198, +2.5 213

I'm sorry, I haven't been the best LLand family member lately, and have been posting in few condos.
My boy, has been pretty much taking all my thoughts.
Today, waiting and waiting and waiting and waiting for the vet to call. He finally called around 2:00pm. I thanked God. But, my fingers were all locked in the fingers crossed position, and still were there on the drive home from work 4 hours later.
I'll try to post in some more condos, tomorrow, but .. with it being my only day off this week, I might not get to a lot.

And, I still have to decide on whether to cancel tomorrow's appointment with J.D.'s regular vet. Dr. B says to see how he does tonight and tomorrow morning and maybe Dr. P (that's what he called him) will be able to go over the test results and give some more feedback that Dr. B missed. We'll see.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198 some BW results

Anne & Zener said:
Well done! You are very brave. I didn't know you should insert the needle with beveled side up either. Why is that?
Liz
Click to expand...
I don't know, but that harpoon seemed to go right in and stayed there.
 
Dyana, you are very brave to give fluids and so is J.D. to be so good receiving them. Good job! We are glad that the test results are encouraging. Sending more healing vines this evening. Hang in there,

Ella & Rusty
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198 some BW results

Dyana said:
that harpoon seemed to go right in and stayed there.
Click to expand...
:lol: :lol: :lol: Dyana, I totally understand that you are focused on J.D. and not on visiting condos. Take care of your boy.
Liz
 
th_ththGreatJob_mcHT_Smiley-vi.gif


I agree with Linda on everything....I just had a chance to go back and look at it. You will be amazed at how long you can maintain early CKD kitties with fluids and a diet a little lower in phosphorus. The Before Grain beef and turkey are low carb and not too bad on the phosphorus.
 
Wow! You did great Dyana! Did JD struggle when the water went in? Sometimes they behave better the first time, second time, they becomes impatient. Beware of that.
Warming the bag definitley help, I submerge the whole bag into hot water with the line part above water. But always test the water temp before giving. You know how they test the baby's milk before giving the baby.
The higher you hang the bag, the faster the water will move. I hang it practically next to the ceiling fan.
The water inside may look less at the bottom & at the top of the bag but the content between the marking is the same.
I use a marker pen to mark a line on the bag everytime before I give the sub-q. This will let me see clearly how much water was inserted.
I always hold the needle after it is inserted because as the water goes in , sometimes the needle will be pushed out. I dont want to stab another time. Beveled side up is because as the water goes in, this will minimize the discomfort.

Take your time Dyana & relax. Our condo is always open for you to visit anytime!
Have a nice weekend!
 
Great job Dyana! The first time is always nerve wracking. I've never had to give fluid to one of my kitters, but did have to do it a number of times at the shelter. And a couple of times there to a cat that later became mine - and he had such a tough old hide.

A friend of mine just lost her CKD cat at age 23 this year. For years her son gave the fluids, then he moved out and she had to learn how to the last year. The fluids make a world of difference.
 
Re: 06/01 J.D. PMPS 198, +2.5 213, +4 291

tortie58 said:
Wow! You did great Dyana! Did JD struggle when the water went in? Sometimes they behave better the first time, second time, they becomes impatient. Beware of that.
Warming the bag definitley help, I submerge the whole bag into hot water with the line part above water. But always test the water temp before giving. You know how they test the baby's milk before giving the baby.
The higher you hang the bag, the faster the water will move. I hang it practically next to the ceiling fan.
The water inside may look less at the bottom & at the top of the bag but the content between the marking is the same.
I use a marker pen to mark a line on the bag everytime before I give the sub-q. This will let me see clearly how much water was inserted.
I always hold the needle after it is inserted because as the water goes in , sometimes the needle will be pushed out. I dont want to stab another time. Beveled side up is because as the water goes in, this will minimize the discomfort.

Take your time Dyana & relax. Our condo is always open for you to visit anytime!
Have a nice weekend!
Click to expand...
Gee, thanks for the forewarning about the 2nd time.
Why do you use the marker on the bag? Please explain. Maybe, I had the bag too high up. It was about shoulder height. Maybe, if I had it lower, I could see the bag better and it wouldn't go in as fast. But, I guess fast is good.

I hope you have a nice weekend, too :-D


J.D. is going in the wrong direction, as he is half the time.
I think it's about time for bed for us.
Hope everyone has a good night.
 
Good job, Dyana!!! I know it must have been a little scary to give fluids the first time...I remember giving them to my Token and I was nervous every time I did it. Doesn't mean it won't get easier for you, lol...I'm just weird that way.
Good test results too. Glad he is doing better!
 
You are so brave Dyana & you too J.D.! We are so proud of you. I was so scared to death when Tawny was so sick last winter that I would have to give her fluids along with everything else but I never had to. I keep hearing how easy it is but I was just terrified (still am) to ever have to do it. Watched a bunch of videos and everything just in preparation.

I didn't know you were supposed to insert the needle bevel side up either! Mercy! The things we learn here!

I hope J.D. continues to improve and gets back to his lovable self quick as can be. As always, we are not posting but are watching over you...

Desi et al
 
Thanks Deb, and it's good to see you. :YMHUG:
It wasn't scary to me for some reason. Actually, I was all anxious to do it, and had to make myself watch a video first.

J.D. has a big ole camel hump lump starting to go down his shoulder now. I just observed him and Ginger give each other a good face washing. I haven't seen that in awhile. Of course they do love their FF Trout Feast, and often take long baths after eating it, to get every morsel :lol:
 
DD & Tinkerbell said:
You are so brave Dyana & you too J.D.! We are so proud of you. I was so scared to death when Tawny was so sick last winter that I would have to give her fluids along with everything else but I never had to. I keep hearing how easy it is but I was just terrified (still am) to ever have to do it. Watched a bunch of videos and everything just in preparation.

I didn't know you were supposed to insert the needle bevel side up either! Mercy! The things we learn here!

I hope J.D. continues to improve and gets back to his lovable self quick as can be. As always, we are not posting but are watching over you...

Desi et al
Click to expand...
Thanks for visiting Desi. I miss you guys. Post Caturday reports, so we can keep up.. :YMHUG: Even if it's just a paragraph. I know you're probably behind in your ss and have a bag of scraps of paper with numbers on them :lol:

Good to see you. Don't be a stranger, k? I've been talking about your book to a lot to people, lately. I loved it.
 
The reason to use a marker to mark the bag is because the bag is hang high up where I can hardly see how much water has went in. Therefore I used a marker to mark the outside of the bag on the units to be used for that insertion. The faster the water go in the less time needed to hold the cat but also it is more discomfort for the cat. One of my friends cat is very calm with the sub-q, she can hold the cat while both watching TV. But for some of my cats, they struggle when I give the sub-q, so it must be quick. Larger needle, faster water flow = shorter time but also more discomfort. If JD is very calm with the sub-q session, definitely a thinner needle & go slowly is better.
 
found this:
http://infusionnurse.org/2010/11/15/bevel-up-or-bevel-down/
but from what I saw on Google, it's an ongoing debate and depends on why and where you're inserting the beveled needle. Apparently insulin syringes are also supposed to be inserted bevel up, but I confess I never looked to see which direction it was facing. That needle was sooo thin that it was hard to tell. On subq needles, it's much easier to see whether the bevel is up or down.

MJ
 
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