Eukanubo (the cat, not the food)

Hello,

I just started posting earlier this week about my Russian Blue Eukanubo, who is on ProZinc 1 unit twice a day and currently, after reading your advice, I'm transitioning from Hills M/D dry to wet food, I'm trying several varieties. So far, his sugars haven't changed that much (OK, it's only been like a couple of days),but he does seem to like the foods I've offered so far. The hard part is that Molly the shorthair doesn't seem to be as enthusiastic about the new foods, so I'm trying to figure out which ones they will both eat without sending his sugar high and without making her vomit. Good that they are doing well otherwise, as playful and active as ever, so I'm trying to be patient here. I just wanted to check in and establish this thread to make it easier to find. Thanks for all your help!

HB

 

So glad he likes the wet food. Have you tried things to make the wet food more enticing for your other kitty? Warm it up in the microwave to make it nice and stinky? Put tuna juice or parmesan cheese on top. Some kitties like Kitty Kaviar sprinkled on top (Bonito flakes).

 

Actually, it's hard to tell how much she's eating because she hates it when I'm around at meal time, I can only guess from the amount left on the dish. Sometimes it seems that she goes days without eating, but somehow she's gotten big, muscular and strong, I just don't see her eating.

On another matter, I meant to post this thread on the PZI forum and messed up, is there any way of relocating the thread?

Thanks
HB

 

Which foods have you selected?

I've noticed that it can take up to a couple weeks for the high carb load to wear off. Maybe others will have more input on the timing. As it stands you are still in the food transition stage correct? I would think you will need to get at least a few days beyond full low carb wet food diet before you will notice anything. It's hard to wait I know, you just want them to be better NOW. :smile:

I'm not a believer in heating the food as cooking food destroys certain needed nutrients [namely taurine]. They can be bedeviling in their pickiness.

 

I'm just starting the transition (OK, so I'm impatient). I picked up several flavors of fancy feast and Friskies, (a couple of cans each flavor) so I'm trying something new each day, mixed in with the dry food, more to see which ones they eat and which ones they won't. I don't really heat the food, but if I only use part of the can, I put the rest in the fridge, when I get it out, I would warm it for 10-15 seconds in the microwave, just to bring it to room temperature, hopefully this won't affect the nutrients.

HB

 

Some here have claimed that even a few kibbles of dry will cause a noticeable spike in their BG. So just keep in mind that the transition must be complete. I'm trusting that the Fancy Feast and Friskies you picked are below 9% or 10% carbs as %kcal from J&B's list.

Even with some of the supposedly low carb dry food I do notice a difference [higher BGs] with relatively small amounts of it. That dry stuff is crazy.

I'm hopeful and excited for you guys. Do keep us updated.

 

Yes, I used the list to pick samples of the different varieties. This morning I fed the Friskies mixed grill and it was a success, he ate all of it at the expense of the kibble, which is mostly untouched. Which brings me to the question, since he obviously prefers this to the kibble, can/should I accelerate the transition?

Thanks!

 

If your cats are eating the canned food you an get rid of the dry. The transition is complete.

 

Update:
Euk is doing great, has been completely off dry food for 5 days, and his BG's are starting to go lower, in fact, I had to skip the evening insulin shot for the last 2 days, he still gets his morning one because his BG is on the low 300s. He is putting on some weight and is not drinking as much water. On the downside, it is now much harder to test his ears, as it takes me now 3-5 tries, and by that time he is hissing and clawing, very understandably so. I'm hoping to be able to back off the testing to just random once I'm sure he is either on a stable regimen with predictable BG's or off insulin completely (if that happens, which I know is not guaranteed).

Any suggestions for a meter that has cheap strips? I'm using now the FreeStyle lite and those strips are very expensive. I was using the True Result meter but it was inacurrate, severely under-estimating his BG's, which resulted in withholding the insulin for a couple of months until he lost so much weight that I took him to the vet and compared my meter and hers, and it was off by 100 points. The cost of the strips can really add up, so, any suggestions?
Thanks
HB

 

Hi HB!
It sounds like you're doing great for your kitty--keep up the good work!

I too keep partial cans of food in the fridge. Several here suggested using a little warm tap water mixed in to the food. I started doing this, especially for the cold food. It took a few days, but now my cats love it. At first, they weren't sure what to make of the 'gravy' but they quickly started liking it. Now, they won't eat without their 'gravy'. I don't measure the h2o, but its approx 1 tbs, I just mix it in to create a kind of slop. It warms the food without using much heat.

I use the bayer contour meter and love it. Cindy sent it to me, so I know its a good one. The strips are reasonable. I recently ordered a box of 100 for $55.

http://www.americandiabeteswholesal...talog.Oem=Bayer / Ascensia&$catalog.OemId=224

I know many here like the relion micro from walmart, and I think the strips are also affordable. I haven't checked the price on those, but its another option.

Jen

 

Good to hear things are moving forward.

You are going to want to keep testing. There are many suggestion about this that can help.

Once you poke their ear sometimes you will not see any blood. Then you have to "milk" the ear. The milking technique is what takes some practice. The only way I can describe it is to set your thumbs on your index fingers with the tips of your index fingers and the tips of your thumbs touching. Then push your thumbs forward. You can vary the angle of your index fingers so that they make a straight line away from each other or make a "V" in either direction. I think I may get the best results when the "V" is a considerably wide "V" [not an upside down "V." Hope this makes sense.

What size lancets are you using? I like 28g lancets. These are the ones I buy from Hocks:
http://hocks.com/hocks-healthcare/hocks ... 80001.html
If you have small lancets like 30g or 31g then this could easily explain your problems.

Make sure you get that ear good and warm. Sometimes it takes a while. I get H in a "safe" place like one of his beds around here. I do it on his ground. Some people advocate doing in a "room of terror" but I think it's better to do it where they feel comfortable.

It takes some practice to get the right setting on the lancer [I call it the clicker]. I like the one that came with my OneTouch Ultra mini. A setting of "4" of "10" - "10" being the deepest - seems about right on it. Some come with a clear cap that one would only use of they were sticking the paw. It just allows deeper lancing I think. Anyway...

You are not aiming for the vein but the sweet spot between the vein and the edge of the ear - right? Even though I thought I had read everything when I got started, somehow I didn't get it right when I started... :roll: When you are done testing apply pressure to the area for about 30 seconds - this will reduce bruising and eventually callousing of the ear.

Make sure to reward Eukanubo [hopefully with a low carb treat] after you test.

Also please post over in PZI Insulin Support Group
http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=24
and we may be able to help you update you dosing.

Why did you not give insulin on those couple days? The usual do not shoot for beginners is 200 and you were above 200.

Are you using U-100 syringes yet? If not you can read about it in the PZI Sticky here:
http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopi ... =24&t=1979
They really help with getting the dose right with PZI/Prozinc.

Any chance you can put together a quick profile [instructions in the Tech Support Forum]? It would help us help you better.

 

the cheapest meter and strips are sold by walmart - relion brand. many people use it and like it. so you may want to look into that.

 

Thanks for your suggestions. I'm using 30 gauge lancets, and the problem is that sometimes I get a nice, big fat drop of blood,sometimes I don't. His ears look like they are sore and I'd hesitate to use a larger size when they look like that. As far as why skipping the insulin, the vet had said to only give insulin if the glucose is over 300. Even if I go by the over 200 criteria, one reading was 205, which is the lowest he's had so far, the other one was I think 228, still rather low, and since I'm just getting started with the wet food, I thought it was better to hold off the insulin rather than risk a hypo.
Since I just bought a new set of testing strips, I'll use these before switching meters, good thing that Wal-Mart is not too far!

A couple more questions: it seems that both cats had a decided preference for one flavor of Friskies (the Mixed Grill), and although they may eat from a couple other flavors, they seem not to eat as much and a lot of it goes to waste. Is there any harm to simply sticking with one flavor only? I would have to have a couple of backups in case that the store is out of their favorite one, but I hope sticking to just one when possible would make things more stable and predictable, right? What about low carb treats, any particular brand recommendations?

Thanks a lot!

 

If you could get a more consistent big drop then you wouldn't have to poke so many times. So a larger gauge could help. It is the number of pokes and your resulting frustration that's central to the issue.

Take a look at this spreadsheet:
https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key ... PEvEZPZvzw
This is Soccer who is over in the PZI group. Soccer was put on ProZinc 1u just like your Eukanubo. There are others too. I cannot guarantee that Eukanubo will go into remission like soccer but I'm pointing to Soccer's spread sheet as a potential game plan for you on dosing. Again, please post over in PZI Insulin Support Group so that you will get more attention to your dosing on ProZinc [ProZinc is a PZI insulin]. I'd like you to get more input on your dosing than just me. And it is somewhat important to try to get things moving along as their chances of remission slowly fade as time moves on.

Feeding just one food is fine. Backups are always needed - they can change their minds on a dime. It will make things more predictable. Hopefully you are free feeding or as close to that as possible. Free feeding is the best policy when using a PZI insulin. Your cats are not overweight, right? Ideally, cats should eat 10-20 small meals per day. Mixing a little water with the wet food help it not dry out.

As for treats I'm not up on that [H is ultra content to just get love - we also give a little deli turkey sometimes and he LOVES fois gras but that's only on special occasions]. I know some use freeze dried chicken. If you search "treat" in the subject on this board I'm sure you will find topics dealing with it.

 

Here is a link to treats:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=445

Here is where I get my treats (cheapest places on internet)

:

http://wholesalesupplementstore.com/liv ... reats.html

http://www.kingwholesale.com/Shopping/i ... fm?id=5994 - I get the largest bag offered and chicken